#41

You can die with prostate cancer if your goal is living to be 70-80. You’re going to die from prostate cancer if you leave it untreated beyond that.
As I understand it, hormone therapy means significant androgen suppression (both testosterone and DHT) which should not lead to feminization.

1 Like
#42

An updated look at the state of treatment.

1 Like
#43

Yup, I hear that, “Oh, that’s the good cancer,” or 96% of those with CaP will die “with” it rather than “off it.”

My response is simple: “I’m one of the 4%.”

That’s what the doc’s say: “Won’t lead to feminization.” Of course, forget having a hard-on, much less give damn. Your biceps melted away long ago, but your weight has gone up. You look a bit funny (moon-faced) because you’re on cortisone. You “only” go through 4 “pads” a day (not 7-8) and your significant other left you because you’re just so whacky moody…

Nope, “won’t lead to feminization.” Hint: Get breast radiation before the boob growth starts, it won’t work afterwards. And Tamoxifen works, sort of as long as breast tissue does not start growing (after it will not reduce it…) And, of course you can get breast reduction surgery but good luck with that as I’ve never heard anyone happy with the outcome.

But, be happy, your CaP’s cured.

Btw…I reserve the right to be overly dramatic…so don’t take me too seriously… :smiley: Btw I can’t die, I take 6mg of Sirolimus each week… :smiling_imp:

11 Likes
#44

Just saw this at DeStrider’s thread about his father-in-law, from a member named Victor:

https://spotify.localizer.co/t/stage-4-pancreatic-cancer-last-ditch-efforts/

Hi all
This is my first message on this forum. The situation with your father-in-law is really difficult. There is no clear solution. I don’t think there are any clinical studies on this. Therefore, you can only look for a very non-formal way out. I once read an article on GreenMedInfo.com a long time ago: Why An Alkaline Approach Can Successfully Treat Cancer. Article here: https://greenmedinfo.com/blog/why-alkaline-approach-can-successfully-treat-cancer#_edn6
The article is certainly entertaining, but I didn’t see anything new that could somehow surprise me, but below, in the comments to the article, one user with the nickname 777Thomas described his experience of treating stage 4 prostate cancer. Below is a quote from his first post:

Just saw this article and skimmed through it. Not that I need a cancer cure. But I did 9 1/2 years ago. I was diagnosed with late stage 4 prostate cancer with my PSA test showing 3,280 My bone scan revealed +120 tumors in my bones with one of them weakening my 5th vertebrae to the extent that I broke my neck. My oncologist and urologist thought I might live 3 more months if I was lucky.
When my PSA started doubling every 6 weeks they said the only left for them to do was admit me to a palliative unit where I could die in a few weeks. And get an unlimited supply of hydromorphine iv and OxyContin + Oxynorm - so I wouldn’t suffer from all the pain.

Great I thought, they’ve got it all figured out for me. But I wasn’t buying their BS and started searching the net for something I could do on my own. UCLA and Ceders-Sinai did a study using rats with human prostate cancer tumors In operated in their bodies. Half of the rats got daily shots of water and the other half got an injection containing the pepper molecule found in cayenne pepper called capsaicin. The rats getting the water injections started dying. While the other half getting the capsaicin injections were doing great. 80% of the tumors placed in their bodies were gone. The remaining 20% had all decreased in size.

So I took 8 capsules/day at breakfast. Starting with 1/2 qt. yoghurt then the capsules followed by the other half of the yoghurt. Waited about 1/2 an hour then I ate a large fiber rich breakfast.

After those 8 weeks of taking these cayenne pepper capsules every day I was to do a new PSA test. The resulting score was only 1.75!!! This really screwed with my oncologists head. She was unbelievably perplexed by this huge drop and asked me if I had changed anything in my life which could account for the score deviation. I lied and said no. (She made me retake all the blood tests again because she thought at the only reasonable explanation was a lab error -they screwed up because there was no way these values could be correct.

After letting my stomach and intestines rest for about 5 weeks I started the 8 week cayenne pepper cure again. After the second time my PSA dropped from 1.75 to <0.05 Or meaning it was so low that it’s undetectable!! And that’s where my PSA has stayed for almost 8 years now.

While I was living on the palliative care unit, where I was supposed to die, I met two other stage 4 prostate cancer patients. Like me they had nothing to lose so both of them did the cayenne pepper cure just like I did. And just like me, instead of just dying there, they were healthy enough to get permanently released. We all agreed, we must spread the truth/word about what happened to us.

5 Likes
#45

Welcome to the forum JuanDaw.

Cancer is very complex. Humans are complex, too. However, humans crave that simple, “magic bullet,” to cure whatever ails them. It’s interesting, I think, the “bullet,” ideally can be purchased at a “reasonable price.” It cannot be free, and it cannot cost astronomical amounts.

Sadly, I could not find 777Thomas’s response, the link you provided does not show comments for me.
Does capsaicin cure cancer? Well, for 777Thomas and his two friends, sure, after all, they were cured. And, if it cured them, well, it should cure me, too (Grade 3, metastatic Prostate Cancer, PSA 54 Gleason 4+4 (8).

Heck, I’ll try it, cayenne is cheap. 777T took “8 capsules a day at breakfast.” (That seems odd, as all chemicals have a half-life, so why not take 2 caps, 4x a day?) (Ah…but then pretty much all of us take sirolimus in a “pulse-pattern.”

“8 cayenne pepper capsules,” are likely 8 x 500mg (since most cayenne capsules on ‘zon are 500mg) so that’s 4 grams a day. That’s easy enough. Hmm…should I buy 40,000 SHU, or 80,000 SHU?

I bought this:

I do like the fact that it’s “8000mg,” cayenne pepper, uh…well, no, it isn’t, it’s 80 milligrams of (hopefully) capsaicin powder (I don’t really care if it’s “extract of cayenne,” or synthetic capsaicin.

I just had my PSA tested a few days ago. I start the ART (Androgen Deprivation Therapy) meds (which I call Androgen Depravity Torture meds) in 3-4 weeks. I’ll pull a PSA then and we’ll see what happens—a real science project!

What I don’t like about 777T’s comment is that it comes across as marketing fluff, which, in fact, it certainly could be. Maybe, just maybe 777T sells a capsaicin product on Amazon. Heck, after reading it, I just bought some.

777T is not telling us that he’s had a radical prostatectomy (if he had not, for instance if he had relied on RT + ART meds, his PSA could not drop to <0.05 because if he still had a prostate, even if his balls had been removed, he’d still have a higher level of T, unless he’s on multiple meds, to stop T from testes + a med like abiraterone (GnRH inhibitor) at the same time. But then, what do I know? Yet, it does sound awfully “pat,” very much like the “magic bullet,” humans universally crave.

PSA from 3,280 > essentially zero in 8 weeks? Gosh, when I pull my next PSA, well, we’ll see…
It is interesting that capsaicin does have multiple anti-cancer properties. But is capsaicin is carcinogenic? See:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0278691595001085?ref=pdf_download&fr=RR-2&rr=8d51d85c5cb8729b

Now, it might come across that I’m poo-pooing the “capsaicin cure,” and I suppose that in a way, I am, yet, in another way, I’m intrigued, enough to try “the cure.”

I’ve spent too many hours researching substances. My goal was simple: I was not looking for anything to cure my cancer. I was looking specifically for substances that were anti-proliferative, often specifically anti-angiogenic.

My tumor is large. At Gleason 4+4 (8) it’s assumed to be aggressive. It has escaped the prostate capsule and invaded nearby structures (though only to a depth of <~8mm. I’ve had more than one doc, without saying it, expected distant mets, yet there are no distant mets (at least ones that show up on a PSMA-pet scan).

To sum this up: I should have mets elsewhere in my body, and yet I don’t. So, why?

Possibly here is an answer:

Over the past year I did 44 days of water fasting (1,2,3-day fasts). About 85% of those days not fasting, I was in >1 ketosis.

Coincidentally, I take Celecoxib (for arthritis); Rosuvastation and Metformin, all of which act as anti-proliferative.

Since July, when I found I have PCa, I’ve added NAC (N-Acetyl-Cysteine); ALA (Alpha Lipoic Acid); Curcumin (1g 98%); Quercetin (1g/day), Melatonin 40mg/day and Trans-Pterostilbene (400mg/day).
All the above were chosen for anti-proliferative/anti-angiogenic properties.

In short, if I assume that my tumor throws off potential mets, I’m hoping to prevent those cells from surviving.

In August my PSA was 54.4. A few days ago, my PSA was 49.9.

We’ll see what it is after some weeks of adding 8 gram equivalent of cayenne pepper.

Note: A warning: Yes, you can buy pure or nearly pure capsaicin but do not try to ingest, or even swallow capsules of it–you are literally playing with fire:

Esophageal Rupture After Ghost Pepper Ingestion
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0736467916302566

2 Likes
#46

With all due respect I am not able to make myself believe that hot pepper will cure cancer, nor that it will make a difference at all. I once happen to sit (on a plane to Italy) next to a doctor. At that time my dad had PC and I was just gauging generalities from him, and I remember him saying to avoid spicy foods. As matter of fact, I happened to love hot/spicy foods and since then I have used them more sparingly. I don’t know if that is the suggestion for other forms of cancer, but he did say for PC. Obviously, no way of knowing either way unless there are scientific studies.
At the end of the day, I don’t think it hursts to try, but don’t expect much from it. My two cents.

My theory is that there are many things one can do to avoid certain medical condition including cancer, but once you get hit with it (any medical condition) the only way to go is chemicals/medicine specifically developed for that purpose. There “could” be certain things that “might” help but not likely to cure. So, I never believe n=1 stories how people cured this and that with keto, or fasting, or hot peppers etc…

3 Likes
#47

I wonder if instead of depriving yourself of all androgens, you could get away with just crushing DHT using high dose dutasteride (2.5-5mg/da)? Stacking that alongside statins, ezetimibe, PCSK9i, SGLT2i and other medications/supplements could provide an environment where cancer is deprived of growth substances without causing too many side effects.

4 Likes
#48

I tried to go to the source as well. But the comments are not available to non-members, or members with free membership plans at greenmedinfo. Paid membership is $8 per month.

There are cell studies.

Akio Mori; Sören Lehmann; James O’Kelly; Takashi Kumagai; Julian C. Desmond; Milena Pervan; William H. McBride; Masahiro Kizaki; H. Phillip Koeffler

Requests for reprints: Sören Lehmann, Cedars-Sinai Medical Center/University of California at Los Angeles School of Medicine,

There is one case report in the article below.

Capsaicin may slow PSA doubling time: case report and literature review - PMC.

#49

Lots of compounds work to inhibit cancer cell growth in-vitro.

2 Likes
#50

Dunno about dutasteride, sure it’s preventative, but is also associated with a potentially more aggressive tumor. But, I’ve chosen Orgovyx + Abiraterone + IMRT + Brachytherapy, which is NOT what 3 of my 4 docs pointed me too. It is fascinating and after a plethora (= too much, way too much) of research, I’ve essentially done what you suggest: “Stacking that alongside statins, ezetimibe, PCSK9i, SGLT2i and other medications/supplements could provide an environment where cancer is deprived of growth substances without causing too many side effects.”

My ART combo has very high quality research and my take is that 1,000 men using my method, versus 1,000 men using Lupron + IMRT only, well, at about 5 years the survival rate is = . But, interestingly, after that my method flat-lines, whereas the “recommended” method continues to drop in suviving.

In short, in the theoretical grouping above. At year 12, about 300 more men are dead than would be dead in my method. Keep in mind that “my method” is standard of care, it’s not really something that I created, it’s just my choice.

I consulted with Alicia Morgans of Dana Farber Cancer since 3 other docs said use Lupron + IMRT only and her take was: “I agree.”

There’s a lot to be said to “feel” that I’ve made the best choice for me, not for the convenience of my doc.

3 Likes
#51

There’s tons of research showing many compounds inhibit cancer, in vitro, in vivo, in rats and in humans. But…there is NO money for anyone that goes that route. No drug company can make a fortune advising Pterostilbene, or NAC, or Quercetin, or…

1 Like
#52

I was diagnosed in early 2014 with PCa - a Gleason 6. At that time I was a little heavy and my Vit D was 19 ng/mL
Started increasing Vit D to maintain above 50 and started metformin as I read of possible lower incidence in people on it. Also quit sugar and my daily donuts. Added dutastoride - some studied indicated it reduced PCa.
Added Rapamycin in 2019 and have focused on reducing inflammation since. Bought a corhealth.com device to track ESR - which is currently down to 2
Some things that worked to reduce inflammation

  • https://synergybioherbals.com/
  • 3 grams omega 3’s daily
  • low dose naltrexone
  • rapamycin
    My BMI is now 20
    I also take 120 mg of melatonin but not sure it has done much but I started it before measuring ESR.
    Same with exercise.
    In 10 years my MRI has not changed nor has my PSA
    This is all N=1 so not sure it is helpful to anyone or not. May not do much for a G8 score
5 Likes
#53

I’m not sure anyone noticed.

Over four months my PSA doubling time went from + > negative.

My PSA went from 54.4 to 49.9.

Of course we go back into the n=1 thing…

I’m just happy that it has not increased, so perhaps what I’m taking has helped…

Food for thought (pun intended)

4 Likes
#54

The effects of high-dose melatonin are neat to read about.

I struggle with IMRT (Rad therapy) and antioxidants, such as melatonin. Helpful or harmful? In a way you are trying to destroy cells, so if one prevents their destruction, would melatonin during radiation therapy be beneficial or not…

So many questions

Btw I have taken 4g/day of Omega 3 Ethyl esters now for decades. My Triglycerides were >300, these days about 50.

I agree, w/ a G8 and extracapsular extension, well, the “enemy is at the gate.” So time to bring out the big guns, even if they hurt my ears.

#55

I’ll agree with what you’ve written.

Still, for 4 months I’ve taken a group of non-toxic substances (derived from food). I have a major, large, what seems to be aggressive cancer and yet over 4 months my PSA has not gone up. It’s dropped.

Some would say: “Well then since that normally does not happen, it’s working.” But others would say, correctly, n=1.

#56

I think Thomas Seyfried has this right. Prostate cancer is particularly a cancer linked to aberrant splicing which is linked to reductions in nucloesolic citrate and acetyl-CoA. (ACLY converts citrate to acetyl-coa).

Hence you need to fix your mitochondria in the prostate gland and increase levels of nucleosolic acetyl-CoA (this can be done in various ways, but i prefer citrate).

I normally do weekly blood tests, but more recently had a period of a blood test twice a week. I find PSA moves around quite a bit and can pop up to 4 some times, but is normally under 1.

I am 64 so in the territory where this becomes an issue and my father died with prostate cancer, but not of prostate cancer.

If i wish to identify any key interventions they would be citrate and melatonin, but I take over 1g of melatonin a night and 10g of citrate a day. (be careful going over 2g of citrate a day and test renal function).

2 Likes
#59

Hot pepper is said to have a strong effect on cancer cells. I remember reading about this ”cayenne therapy.” I am sorry that I have not been able to find the doses that were used.

I also remember that peppers might irritate the prostate. That should not be a reason to stop. Some have proposed that the irritating feeling is an effect of increased ROS levels, which in turn start a chain reaction that makes the cells go into apoptosis.

I am a layman in this field, but I would be careful with taking NAC and other antioxidants if I am on a therapy that aims at putting cancer cells into apoptosis. In some therapies, antioxidants cancel out the effects of anti-cancer therapy. Examples.

I have focused on piperlongumine (A substance in Indian long pepper) This since it also might act on mTOR and at the same time deplete the androgene receptor in the prostate.

1 Like
#60

I don’t know many sources of good quality piperlongumine. But I trust this one. When it comes to piperlongumine it shows effects on cancers in many organs, even at cancers in the brain. It is also quite bioavailable.

1 Like
#62

Thank you. What sort of “form” of Citrate do you take? Citric acid? Would you suggest dosages? For instance 500mg 2x/ day w/ or without food? It’s certainly cheap enough.

I wish I could access blood tests weekly. It’s like pulling teeth to get my doc to order much. Recently, I asked for a HgA1C, nope…must wait 1 year, “you had that 10 months ago.” (I’d like to know because I’ve added Metformin.

1g Melatonin is a lot, but with it’s short half-life, by the next dose, I imagine you’re down to zero, practically speaking. I’d love to do 1g Melatonin while getting IMRT (Rad therapy) but I cannot figure out, will it then protect the PCa cells?

With your dad’s PCa you might want to check for hereditary genetic markers, I did and the results:

" No genetic variants (also called mutations) were found that directly impact your personal risk for a hereditary cancer condition. This test analyzed 29 genes associated with the most common hereditary cancer conditions. A full list of the genes included on this test can be found in the Details section of your report and at color.comopens in new tab."

Genes
APC (257430), ATM (278616), BAP1 (460680), BARD1 (260947), BMPR1A (372037), BRCA1 (357654), BRCA2 (544455), BRIP1
(259008), CDH1 (261769), CDK4 (257904), CDKN2A (p14ARF, 304494), CDKN2A (p16INK4a, 579755), CHEK2 (328354), EPCAM**
(263735), GREM1 (300177), MITF* (394351), MLH1 (231790), MSH2 (233146), MSH6 (234420), MUTYH* (450313), PALB2*
(261584), PMS2 (265849), POLD1* (440232), POLE* (320574), PTEN (371953), RAD51C (337432), RAD51D (345365), SMAD4*
(342988), STK11 (326873), TP53 (269305)

I got it done for free as they’re trying to create a database. My cancer came from Agent Orange, I’m sure of that. I used to come home with my legs wet with 1:50 2-4-5-T/D mixed in kero, which I used to spray as a herbicide under power lines in 1970.

Yup, I’ve heard, too often: “Well, it’s a good cancer…95% die with prostate cancer and only 5% die of it.” Hmm…since my PCa is metastatic I respond: “…and you may well be looking at one of the 5%.” That slows some down…

And too, there are a whole lot of men listed as dying of stroke, MI’s and so on that, in reality, died because of the PCa. Those ART meds whallop a guy in so many ways, pushes up BP, BG, metabolic syndrome on steroids, and causes so much fatigue that many just sit on a couch and get fat, which is understandable when all of a sudden one has zero energy.

#63

I tend to agree, but one must look at the situation.

Recently I decided that I needed a blood test even more than one per day, so I got them every hour…in fact, every minute… and I learned a whole lot!

It was a CGM. I learned that when I work out w/ heavy weights for an hour + my BG shoots up. But, I also found that after doing heavy lifting, if I did just 12 minutes of Zone 2 cardio, my BG would drop 25 points—and stay there. I consider a CGM to be worthwhile for anyone doing life extension. Flatten the BG levels and reduce AGE’s and live forever…hmmm

2 Likes