I’m sorry, I don’t understand your point.
A randomized, triple-blinded, placebo-controlled study and another triple-blinded, placebo-controlled investigation demonstrate that Pantethine lowers LDL, triglycerides, and total cholesterol. This is complementary to the body’s production.
Pantethine, a derivative of vitamin B5, favorably alters total, LDL and non-HDL cholesterol in low to moderate cardiovascular risk subjects eligible for statin therapy: a triple-blinded placebo and diet-controlled investigation. (Vascular health and risk management, 2014)
“Pantethine, a derivative of vitamin B5, favorably alters total, LDL and non-HDL cholesterol in low to moderate cardiovascular risk subjects eligible for statin therapy: a triple-blinded placebo and diet-controlled investigation”
“A one-year clinical trial ([11]) found that pantethine treatment led to consistent and statistically significant reductions in total cholesterol, LDL-C, and apolipoprotein B, with parallel increases in HDL-C and apolipoprotein A in patients with various types of dyslipidemia, with or without diabetes mellitus.”
“Pantethine, a derivative of vitamin B5, favorably alters total, LDL and non-HDL cholesterol in low to moderate cardiovascular risk subjects eligible for statin therapy: a triple-blinded placebo and diet-controlled investigation - PubMed”
Effectiveness of long-term treatment with pantethine in patients with dyslipidemia - PubMed"
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gris
#22
Who really knows whether that’s the dominating effect? It’s not well studied. For example, pantethine also breaks down into cysteamine which has been shown to increase growth rates in many types of mammals (and increasing insulin and IGF-1 levels which would be anti-longevity). Cysteamine also interferes with the liver’s production of cholesterol and triglycerides, so that pathway could actually be responsible for the lipid effects. Mechanistically, this wouldn’t be as good as increasing fatty acid oxidation IMO. Separately, there’s also some research that pantethine directly inhibits HMCGR, though I haven’t looked into what concentrations.
There are a bunch of things you can take to get lipids down, so I’d be selective and look for ones with data or at least mechanisms that suggest positive outcomes on CV/aging and that are safe otherwise.
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Ulf
#23
Indeed, pantethine’ s beneficial effects on lipids seem to be through creation of cysteamine https://digitalcommons.usu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=6388&context=etd
However, when cysteamine is supplemented to a relatively close mammal, pigs, the negative anti-aging effects mentioned by gris are manifested. Also, mTOR signaling is promoted. Excerpts further down.
But a not deep search yields no shown connection between pantethine supplementation and IGF1, insulin, or mTOR activation.
Is absence of evidence an indication that the pig study on cysteamine supplementation is of no concern for pantethine supplementation for humans?
A study showing the effects of pantethine supplementation on over-all health (as opposed to only lipid values) or mortality would be revealing, but I can’t find one which is not surprising.
‐----------------------
From “Effects of Dietary Crude Protein Levels and Cysteamine Supplementation on Protein Synthetic and Degradative Signaling in Skeletal Muscle of Finishing Pigs”:
“CS (cysteamine) supplementation also increased the concentrations of plasma insulin-like growth factor 1 (IGF-1) (P <0.001), and reduced the concentrations of leptin, SS, and PUN (P <0.001). Increased mRNA abundance of Akt1 and IGF-1 signaling (P <0.001) and decreased mRNA abundance of Forkhead Box O (FOXO) 4 (P <0.01) and muscle atrophy F-box (P< 0.001) were observed in pigs receiving CS. Additionally, CS supplementation increased the protein levels for the phosphorylated mammalian target of rapamycin (mTOR), eIF-4E binding protein 1, and ribosomal protein S6 kinase 1 (P <0.001). … In conclusion, dietary protein levels and CS supplementation influenced growth and protein metabolism through independent mechanisms in pigs…
…
Moreover, CS supplementation improved growth performance, possibly by mediating plasma IGF-1 concentrations, thereby promoting mTOR signaling and suppressing Akt/FOXO signaling in skeletal muscle of finishing pigs”.
FWIW, I tried pantethine recently and the side effects were so severe, I stopped after only 3 doses of 300mg. Depersonalization, anhedonia, hopelessness; literally looking at my kids talk about something excitedly and not feeling any connection with them. Forcing myself to smile and act normal around people but not caring at all about anyone or anything, including myself.
My last 300mg dose was about 30 hours ago, and I’m still not back to normal, not even close. But at least there are slivers of feelings coming through now and then. I’m not sure why I had such a strong reaction to this supplement, and hopefully others don’t experience this. Bottom line is even seemingly benign supplements can powerful impact individual biologies, so proceed with caution everyone.
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Sad to hear this. However, thats interesting and important to know. I took 4g yesterday without any effects like that. What brand did you take?
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I can’t imagine taking 4g of this stuff. It’s NOW brand.
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I take a different brand, but i think i have taken those in the past. ChatGPT saud there was a reddit post in which someone else said this.
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Thanks John, probably this one.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Supplements/comments/89tewn/pantethine_vit_b5_active_form_gave_me_the_most/?rdt=39513
I don’t know what it is, maybe I don’t metabolize cysteamine well, or maybe it causes imbalances in my neurochemistry.
Whatever it is, it’s not pleasant.
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It demonstrates how vitamins particularly B vitamins impact on metabolism. Panthenoic acid is rate limited.
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AnUser
#31
Supplements have not gone through the dozens of safety, and efficacy studies that FDA approved drugs have, i.e that came into place because of thalidomide scandal, and don’t probably have post-market surveillance. They have a much higher probability of being contaminated or just outright banned or research chemicals that gets raving reviews. If you bought it from Amazon it might also be a counterfeit product (unless it was from NOW store). Amazon has lots of fakes. But this type of reaction can even happen to approved drugs, so it can just be a very rare reaction, sorry to hear this! I place my bet more on pharma than supplements for safety and efficacy because they actually have been extensively studied and in many cases have long historical, recorded, data.
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I’ve become sceptical of many supplements aswell due to their side effects. At least with medication you know about most relevant side effects but everyone pretends that supplements are perfectly safe because they are “natural”.
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