#12

The Safety and Tolerability of Lumbrokinase DLBS1033 in Healthy Adult Subjects

And

A Clinical Trial on Biological Half Life of Bioactive Protein from Lumbricus rubellus, DLBS1033 in Healthy Volunteers

#13

Both studies too small, first had 20 people, second 14 people.
At this point it seems like a weird alternative medicine supplement. Like sold on infomercials.
The optics aren’t great.

#14

Efficacy and safety of lumbrokinase plus aspirin versus aspirin alone for acute ischemic stroke (LUCENT): study protocol for a multicenter randomized controlled trial

#15

8.6 hours in case anybody’s interested but does not want to read.

#16

Still another supplement when taken in the therapeutic range causes me excessive gassiness, along with Acarbose, trehalose, erythritol, etc.

Unfortunately, maybe because I am old, there are many supplements cannot take because they mess with my digestive system. What I can take daily without the digestive consequences that some others experience is up to two tbsps of EVOO and C8 oil.
So I will be skipping Nattokinase

#17

desertshores, review William Davis’s book Super Gut.

Attached is a PDF copy

Super Gut A Four-Week Plan to Reprogram Your Microbiome, Restore Health, Lose Weight (William Davis).pdf (3.6 MB)

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#18

The dose required for it to be effective are high, and judging by the price, that would be an expensive way to prevent ascvd. We’re also not sure if this is a dirty drug, meaning if it has any offtargets effects.

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#19

$22.00 for a 40 day supply at 12,000FU per day is expensive?

.55¢ a day for 12,000FU

#20

Oh nice! I was going off what I saw from Amazon. Thanks for the correction

#22

Bestvite, no the product is in capsules.

#23

Thanks, I’ll give it a read.

#25

My intention is to follow the procedure published in the first paper mentioned in this thread titled;

Effective management of atherosclerosis progress and hyperlipidemia with nattokinase: A clinical study with 1,062 participants

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#26

I used to have lots of uncomfortable gassiness with many things. Alcohol sugars and fruit, legumes, and brassica caused uncomfortable gas and I bloated and belched more than farted. I started to figure it out when I noticed if I ate 1/2 an apple a day for 2 days. I had uncomfortable gut symptoms. This was before many docs knew about small intestinal bacterial overgrowth. I remember my Group Health Coop doc mocking me when I told him about it. I suggested he search on Pimentel and gut and found another, more competent, physician who ordered a stool test and I had a very high percentage of lactobacilli, yogurt bacteria. And very low butyric acid. We did a hydrogen breath test and hydrogen came up at the time associated with the small intestine. I do not absorb fructose and the fructose fermented in my small intestine feeding lactobacilli.

I had read about C Butyricom probiotic from Japan. The brand name is Miyarisan. It eats the kind of things that caused me gut problems and turns them into butyric acid. I describe taking Miyarisan to friends with gut problems as the microbiome equivalent of having gay artists more into a slum neighborhood. 10 years, later instead of being full gang bangers, it is full of young families with children. I went on a very low carb diet and took increasingly higher amounts of Miyarisan. 10 years later, I have almost perfect gut function. Gluten is the only food I need to avoid. And the occasional cross contamination exposure that used to make my joints hurt and give me brain fog isn’t a problem anymore. I can even eat some fruit now too.

Here is a recent C butyricum gang banger biome study. There are many more.

“The results suggest that C. butyricum restores epithelial hypoxia caused by S. Enteritidis, improves the stability of intestinal flora, and inhibits the proliferation of Salmonella.”

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#27

FWIW

If you are looking to treat SIBO, if you have not seen/read
William Davis’s book Super Gut.

Poster a PDF copy on this thread see:

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#28

I took a low rate (2000 fu) for years and there were studies that said it does nothing for heart disease. Then Joseph I believe posted this one:

So it turns out I was just using too low a dosage. Now I alternate between 10000 IU Natto and Lumbro (I think 800000). To be honest I haven’t studied this enough to know what the numbers mean. I just do a bottle of one, then a bottle of the other. I feel like it’s tested well enough to be safe.

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#29

Oh crap I meant to post this elsewhere.

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#31

Has anybody on here used Nattokinase to reduce/remove plaque from their arteries? With before & after testing to verify?

A CT Angiogram recently discovered I have a 70% blockage in one artery. It’s soft plaque (calcium score was zero). I am considering Nattokinase as an approach to address it.

FWIW - I am also actively managing ApoB as low as possible. I have very high lp(a) levels and am doing what I can to bring these down (primarily PCSK9 inhibitor and Niacin). And improving fitness and diet.

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#32

My brother did it for his carotids. They checked his CIMT and said he was in trouble, I showed him the study that said to use 10000, so he used 12000 for a year and it disappeared. His CAC went backwards too. But now it’s come back and then some.

Did they use contrast on you? I’m curious what test would tell me about my soft plaque. Would it be CT angiogram with contrast? Why did they decide to do that on you? Do you have to have a heart attack to get that done?

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#33

What specific lab tests to order for hyperlipidemia and atherosclerosis concerns and where? Please add to list below.
Lp(a) - Labcorp offers this as a separate item
ApoB - Labcorp only offers as part of a panel

#34

Yes, they used contrast on me. After reading Outlive, I’ve recently become interested in longevity (& started Rapamycin). I’m young (45), fit & healthy, so other than high lp(a), I didn’t think I’d have CVD, but wanted to rule it out. So I asked for a CT Angiogram thinking it’d be something I’d repeat every 5-10 years. The Doc’s tried to get me to do other tests, but I insisted on a CT Angiogram (because other tests can miss things). It helped that I was personally prepared to pay for it. Anyway, glad I’ve found it! In the New Year I will tick off a range of Cancer screening. Again, I don’t anticipate finding anything - hopefully no other surprises there!! :slight_smile:

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