约瑟夫
#25
From the paper post above;
Conclusion: …“This study suggests that the use of statin is significantly associated with a decreased risk of dementia. Future studies measuring such outcomes would provide useful information to patients, clinicians, and policymakers. Until further evidence is established, clinicians need to make sure that statin use should remain restricted to the treatment of cardiovascular disease”…
jakexb
#26
Certainly, they’re emphasizing that this analysis only suggests a lower incidence in the context of cardiovascular disease but it may not treat dementia directly, ie they’re not suggesting based on this analysis that it is an all-cause dementia treatment.
‘The study design was supervised by professor Matt Kaeberlein.’
And everybody knows what an unpublished profiteering hack he is. (/sarc apparently needed)
3 Likes
约瑟夫
#28
I stand by my statement, this “study” will produce Bupkis.
In the future{if this study is ever complete] we will see who is correct.
“The trial will produce very little results, if any of scientific value. With a reported cost of $400,000, the one positive result, the trial will be quite profitable to some individuals.”
Carnac the Magnificent
Carnac was a “mystic from the East” who could psychically “divine” unknown answers to unseen questions.
Speculation is an opinion or conclusion formed on the basis of incomplete information rather than knowledge.
I while I agree that LDL-C exposure is main drive of ASCVD use of statins in low risk population based on knowledge we have today about statin therapy might be that statins only marginally add to cumulative effects of lifestyle and because of possible adverse effects I would think twice before recommending them to anyone in this situation.
- LDL-C is not the only cause of ASCVD
- there is enough evidence that while on statins other risk factors might become elevated (e.g. while reducing apoB concentration there might be increase in number of (other) atherogenic particles)
- data from statin studies show decrease in ASCVD events but decrease is smaller than decrease in LDL-C levels
- there are no studies on primary prevention in low risk population with decent duration that would allow unambiguous conclusions
1 Like
Yes, Cochrane review confirm this.
Authors’ conclusions
There is good evidence that statins given in late life to people at risk of vascular disease do not prevent cognitive decline or dementia. Biologically, it seems feasible that statins could prevent dementia due to their role in cholesterol reduction and initial evidence from observational studies was very promising. However, indication bias may have been a factor in these studies and the evidence from subsequent RCTs has been negative. There were limitations in the included studies involving the cognitive assessments used and the inclusion of participants at moderate to high vascular risk only.
https://www.cochranelibrary.com/cdsr/doi/10.1002/14651858.CD003160.pub3/full?highlightAbstract=dementia|dementi|statin|statins
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Did you conveniently ignore the two studies I posted above the video (which Dr. Stanfield references)?
约瑟夫
#32
Do not take this the wrong way.
I do not waste my time* {the most valuable asset any person has] on a YouTube schnorrer.
Who’s comments and interpretation on papers are minimal a best.
If he{Brad Stanfield] would have a debate with any of the people who were the authors of the papers, the authors would chew him up and spit him out.
-
"Time is our most valuable asset, yet we tend to waste it, kill it and spend it rather than invest it.*
~ Jim Rohn
zazim
#33
Every single study shows that reducing LDL (and better yet ApoB) results in a reduction of cardiovascular events and mortality. And people like me that have relatively low LDL and high ApoB are at a greater risk than than people with high LDL and low ApoB.
Recent studies demonstrate that you keep gaining benefits by continuing to lower LDL and ApoB even below normal levels.
2 Likes
No particular reason to continue the statin debate. No minds are going to be changed at this point.
When my first cardiologist suggested a statin and was addressing my misgivings, I had no misgivings about statins but drugs in general, he said that was some evidence that statin use might also lower the incidence of dementia.
There is no definitive proof that statins prevent dementia. There is even less proof that statins increase dementia.
The risk of taking a statin is minimal. The risk of not taking a statin if you need to is much greater than not taking one.
“Compared with no statins use, statins use was associated with dementia risk decrement (relevant risk [RR]: 0.85; 95% confidence interval [CI], 0.80–0.89; P < 0.01) (Table (Table3).3). Furthermore, statins use was significantly associated with dementia risk decrement in female (RR: 0.89; 95% CI, 0.80–0.98; P < 0.01) (Table (Table3)3) and male (RR: 0.88; 95% CI, 0.83–0.93; P < 0.01) (Table (Table3).3). In addition, statins use was significantly associated with dementia risk decrement in Caucasia (RR: 0.89; 95% CI, 0.83–0.96; P < 0.01) (Table (Table3)3) and male (RR: 0.92; 95% CI, 0.84–0.97; P < 0.01) (Table (Table33).”
“Results from Egger’s tests indicated no evidence of publication bias among these studies”
“To sum up, statins use was associated with dementia risk decrement, and it is expected to become an important auxiliary means of dementia treatment. Due to the limitation of the quality and quantity of the inclusion study, more high-quality, large sample, and multicenter RCT are needed to verify the conclusions of this study in the future.”
“Statins use and risk of dementia - PMC”
5 Likes
AnUser
#35
Yes the association studies are mixed for/against statins. For dementia decrease. Or increase in some studies. And liver cancer a large decrease. Kidney disease small increase. The “ground truth” is the randomized controlled trials they were based on - the benefits and side effects on those trials are probably the closest thing to real, and most side effects are <10% probability and reversible.
I totally agree with this! If you need statins TAKE THEM!
But the study on dementia is probably one of these fake Chinese ones. One author has published over 15.000 articles, the other 9.000… to put it in perspective, Blagosklonny published 275 articles, Sinclair 264…
约瑟夫
#37
This is a fact, most would agree.
4 Likes
zazim
#38
They monitor desmosterol for patients that are at risk of dementia. It is not a reason not to take a statin, but it’s not a risk to ignore either.
2 Likes
I found a copy of the paper in the OP on the net and thought people might like to read it. I have not really put in the effort to work out what my view is on this issue. I am not taking statins at the moment. I did have a statin prescribed in 2003, but stopped later that year I also ate some Red Yeast Rice for a while, but thought it messed up my memory so stopped.
Its a curious paper, but to come to a conclusion on the broader issue would take quite a bit of reading.
2015-Statins-stimulate-atherosclerosis-and-heart-failure-pharmacological-mechanisms.pdf (1.4 MB)
Jonas
#40
Cardiologist: Your Doctor Is WRONG About Cholesterol | Dr. William Davis
Another doctor here not keen on statin:
Oh great, another youtube doctor for me to block. Hopefully those kinds of people eventually get sued for everything they have when their viewers start getting strokes and heart attacks.
4 Likes
Jonas
#42
Different lipid testing, LPA is mostly tested by cardiologist
Statins seem to work pretty well from what I can tell…
https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/01.cir.0000012530.68333.c8
And:
Consistent with the earlier statement in the Cardiovascular Health thread about how what matters is the total time that LDL(c) is too high… they impact on the younger people is very strong (e.g. the 50 to 59 age group):
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