#5

@John_Hemming Thank you for posting this data.

I’m interested in whether you noticed any other side effects?

I have taken 8mg with GFJ before. I noticed an uncomfortable feeling when trying to get to sleep for a couple of days, like a dizziness that was somewhat ominous. It was enough to put me off larger doses. Other than that, I felt okay, and I did experience a mild euphoria a few hours after like I’ve seen others mention.

#6

This is 22mg plus GFJ a sort of equivalent of 77mg when the GFJ is taken into account. I have a blood draw planned for today and Monday. Monday is a different lab, but when I have both today’s result and Monday’s result and last Monday I will post all the relevant blood results. The lab I am using today (Randox) has a very wide basic panel. If people are in the UK and wish to use Randox I may be able to get them a discount (I make no money out of this, but it will give me brownie points with Randox to bring them custom).

I will publish the list of tests and if people want the results for those tests as well as the ones I do publish I will do those.

I also intend to do more of an analysis of the above.

In terms of unexpected side effects. The expected ones happened, but perhaps in an unexpected way (more to be said with the blood tests).

I did have a couple of intestinal twinges which may have been related to rapamycin, but may not.

I am thinking about what to do in the future about this. I definitely will make more use of the CGM. I am not persuaded that this dose with multiplier is safe for everyone. Because of my other supplementation I have a particularly strong immune system which is why I normally have a relatively low WBC. The lab phoned me to warn me that my WBC was particularly low at under 2 billion per litre.

This could be a problem for someone without the other immune support.

I did have a spot on one of my legs, but that happens from time to time anyway. The interesting thing, however, is that the nadir in WBC is quite a while after taking the rapamycin. I need to put the results together to work out when it was (It is now in the past).

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#7

I now have all the blood tests I want to receive before doing an analysis. I have a court case today, but I hope to spend some time after that doing the analysis. Are there any particular blood biomarkers people would wish to see in the analysis?

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#8

@John_Hemming id be curious about markers of inflammation: hsCRP, ferritin, fibrinogen to see if the body reacts to rapa as an inflammatory or anti-inflammatory (should be anti inflammatory with a reduction in immune system effect but might be hard to separate gut effects). Also, rapa impact on sex hormones (does a big dose of rapa show up as an energy deficit effect?). Did you lose weight after a big rapa dose?

#9

This is very confusing to me. The blood values drop much faster than 30 hours but perhaps the effects last longer. I can confirm that the effect on my immune system is an immediate weakening (anything already present gets worse in 24 hours). New infections (pimples) don’t arrive for 3-5 days. I almost always get one pimple on my neck. I also get impressive muscle soreness in the 24 hours post dosing, which would be 48 hours post workout. Times should be read as +- 12 hours.

#10

This is the first post with the blood data in it. I will aim to collate linked information and post that information. Rapamycin was taken on 23rd September. All of the tests were with the same lab apart from the last one which is from a different lab. Dates are in the UK format (day/month)

Biomarker 17-Sep 24-Sep 01-Oct 04-Oct 07-Oct 10-Oct 14-Oct 17-Oct 21-Oct
Red BC 4.62 4.84 5.05 4.61 4.53 4.72 4.58 4.53 4.48
White BC 2.79 2.31 2.1 1.93 1.89 1.84 1.95 2.24 2.7
Neutrophils 1.68 1.09 1.09 1.02 0.97 0.89 0.81 1.08 1.6
Lymphoc 0.81 0.94 0.76 0.69 0.67 0.7 0.80 0.82 0.7
29.03% 40.69% 36.19% 35.75% 35.45% 38.04% 41.03% 36.61% 25.93%
Monocytes 0.28 0.26 0.22 0.19 0.23 0.22 0.31 0.31 0.2
Eosinophils 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Basophils 0.02 0.02 0.03 0.03 0.02 0.03 0.03 0.03 0
Platelets 156 173 143 122 146 156 161 162 150

What I find interesting about this is that it appears that rapamycin affects the creation of all of the cells with material numbers. I am normally leukopenic and with a high level of mTOR inhibition my lab was phoning me up to tell me I was even more leukopenic.

With Rapamycin taken on 23rd September, the lowest level of WCC was probably around 10 October, the lowest level of platelets was more like 4 October and the measuring of red cell creation is probably not precise enough to tell although it does look like rapamycin had an effect. It looks like most of the effect was on Neutrophils.

Edit 11/11/24

It has been pointed out to me that the half life of neutrophils is a lot shorter than lymphcytes and other WBCs. There a conflicting answers online as to exactly how short, but that would explain the more rapid change in neutrophil numbers.

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#11

@John_Hemming Thanks. Very interesting. A long effect indeed. How do you control for hydration for your blood tests?

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#12

Thats a good point. I don’t have perfect control on this and that adds a bit more uncertainty. My objective is to have the blood draw at the same time each day (it varies by a few minutes) with me having eaten and drunk roughly the same amount of food/drink (tea etc). I accept, however, that this is vulnerable to variations as to the amount of water in circulation at the time. I don’t know what effect this could have, but one would assume it is the same to each of the biomarkers.

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#13

This is to look at inflammation

Biomarker 17-Sep 24-Sep 01-Oct 04-Oct 07-Oct 10-Oct 14-Oct 17-Oct 21-Oct
CRP <0.3 <0.3 <0.3 <0.3 <0.3 <0.3 <0.3 <0.3 0.753 mg/L
Ferritin 24.22 52.63 39.92 38.59 36.08 35.83 33.15 28.84 34.3 mcg/L
C4 0.138 0.124 0.129 0.118 0.131 0.127 0.121 0.121 - g/l
IgA 1.979 2.461 2.132 1.976 2.408 2.203 2.526 2.085 - g/l
Urate 305.4 347.9 279.2 287.1 313.1 359.7 242.3 302.2 349 mcmol/L

I don’t really read anything into this from the inflammation point of view. It looks like I had some form of infection over the weekend, but I don’t know what that was.

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#14

Here is glucose and lipids. Remember these are non-fasting results.

Biomarker 17-Sep 24-Sep 01-Oct 04-Oct 07-Oct 10-Oct 14-Oct 17-Oct 21-Oct
HbA1c 34 34.41 34.08 31.8 34.76 34.07 29.63 29.41 30 mmol/L
Insulin 262.6 91.8 178.2 292.8 241.3 225.3 212.4 146.8 pmol/L
Cholest. 5.9 6.01 6.58 5.96 5.38 5.85 5.48 5.43 5.66 mmol/L
LDL 3.14 3.54 4.1 3.41 3.09 3.09 3.09 2.84 3 mmol/L
HDL 1.65 1.82 1.88 1.66 1.63 1.87 1.83 1.63 1.81 mmol/L
LP(a) 7.2 7.4 9.1 8.9 <5.2 <5.2 6.6 <5.2 - nmol/L
ApoB 96 96 96 84 93 100 92 97 - mg/dl
Trig 2.37 1.73 2.09 2.07 2.25 2.38 1.47 1.39 1.86 mmol/L

HbA1c is a bit of an odd thing as the glycation of Haemoglobin is initially reversible and then becomes much less reversible. Hence it does not really give a strict average of glucose. The charts up topic are much better for seeing what is happening with glucose.

I think it is particularly significant that it goes up initially, but really with a movement of the baseline, the body then turns up insulin such that you get an overswing and the body removes glucose more quickly. I think in the final insulin figure you can see movement towards correcting this.

Interestingly the cholesterol things seem to happen really coincidental with mTOR inhibition. LP(a) goes up for a bit then back down. LDL-C seems to follow this although ApoB seems to not really follow any pattern it may be testing variation.

Looking at my historic Lp(a) records the top two values over the past year (I did not always use the lab that measures this) were the two in this post. Hence it seems that there is a causal link here.

#15

I have extracted the list of tests from the reports

Haemoglobin, Haematocrit, Mean Cell Haemoglobin (MCH), “Mean Cell Haemoglobin Concentration (MCHC)”, “Red Blood Cell Mean Cell Volume (MCV)”, Red Blood Cell Count, Basophil Count, Eosinophil Count, Lymphocyte Count, Monocyte Count, Neutrophil Count, White Blood Cell Count, Full Blood Count, Platelet Count, Iron, Ferritin, “Total Iron Binding Capacity (TIBC)”, Transferrin, Transferrin Saturation, Total Cholesterol, LDL Cholesterol, HDL Cholesterol, Total Cholesterol / HDL Cholesterol Ratio, Triglycerides, Apolipoprotein A-I, Apolipoprotein B, Apolipoprotein B / A-I Ratio, Apolipoprotein CIII, Small LDL Cholesterol, Lipoprotein (a), “High Sensitivity C-Reactive Protein (hsCRP)”, Creatine Kinase, Fatty Acid Binding Protein-3 (FABP-3), Glucose, HbA1c, Insulin, C-peptide, Glucose, HDL Cholesterol, Triglycerides, HbA1c, Insulin, C-peptide, Leptin, Resistin, “High Sensitivity C-Reactive Protein (hsCRP)”, Creatinine, “Estimated Glomerular Filtration Rate (eGFR)”, Cystatin C, Calcium (adjusted), Chloride, Magnesium, Phosphate, Potassium, Sodium, Urea, Uric Acid, Alanine Aminotransferase (ALT), Alkaline Phosphatase (ALP), “Aspartate Aminotransferase (AST)”, “Gamma-Glutamyltransferase (GGT)”, Total Bilirubin, Albumin, Ferritin, Pancreatic Amylase, Lipase, H. pylori, “Anti-Tissue Transglutaminase Antibodies (Coeliac Disease)”, Total Antioxidant Status (TAS), Albumin, Calcium (adjusted), Magnesium, Iron, Folic acid, Vitamin B12, Vitamin D, Creatine Kinase, Uric Acid, Rheumatoid Factor (RF), Alkaline Phosphatase (ALP), Calcium (adjusted), Phosphate, Vitamin D,Parathyroid Hormone (PTH), Allergy Evaluation, Immunoglobulin E (IgE), C-Reactive Protein (CRP), Rheumatoid Factor (RF), Complement Component 3 (C3), Complement Component 4 (C4), Immunoglobulin A (IgA), Immunoglobulin G (IgG), Immunoglobulin M (IgM), Antistreptolysin O (ASO), “Thyroid Stimulating Hormone, (TSH)”,Follicle Stimulating Hormone, Luteinising Hormone, Prolactin, “Thyroid Stimulating Hormone (TSH)”, Free Thyroxine (FT4), Free Tri-iodothyronine (FT3), “Anti-Thyroglobulin Antibody (Anti-Tg)”,“Anti-Thyroid Peroxidase Antibody (Anti-TPO)”, “Total Prostate Specific Antigen (TPSA)”, Follicle Stimulating Hormone, Oestradiol,Luteinising Hormone, Prolactin,Testosterone,Sex Hormone Binding Globulin, Free Testosterone

#16

In retrospect I think each high dose probably slightly improved kidney function although this is hard to tell given everything else that is happening, but a new recent minimum of creatinine was achieved. Also I think further follicular development occurred. Hence I have decided to take a similar dose (22mg plus GF), but without doing as many blood tests or running a CGM all the time. I will aim to run a CGM for the period when the average rapidly reduces.

#17

Have you tested cystatin-c for kidney function? Creatinine is far too unspecific of a marker of kidney function in people with healthy kidney function so any mild changes in it could be from a number of factors other than changes in kidney health.

#18

Cystatin-C has some other issues which I am trying to bottom out. I did get it down to 0.67, but it is over 1 at the moment.

What I am not clear on is the timescales during which these things turn over, but I have enough records to read into the values sufficient information.

#19

I’m not aware of any partiuclar issues with Cystatin-C but everything has downsides. Have you found any specific issues with it so far?

#20

I have not come to any conclusions. It is not currently my priority for testing.

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#21

Interestingly on this I took another high dose of Rapamycin on Sunday and did a blood test yesterday. The result for HbA1c today is 4.71%. (28 mmol/mol)

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#22

Adding to this. I monitor my resting heart rate from fitbit. This is higher when drinking than not drinking. However, in the week after taking a high dose of rapamycin it is perhaps 6-7 beats per minute higher post rapamycin than pre rapamycin (when not drinking). I think this is because serum glucose is higher.

I post this now as it is the same for the third dose. (ie higher)

#23

I am not going to post another topic for the third high dose, but I would confirm from the early results that LDL-C goes up quite quickly although on this occasion Lp(a) has remained low and ApoB is 80. I am using a lab completely new to me, however.

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#24

@John_Hemming - this is awesome data- thanks so much for posting it in detail - and look forward to the next edition.

I have been measuring fasted glucose just using a finger prick and likewise - found a fasted blood glucose peak at 6.7 mm/ Dl, which at higher end of pre diabetic range is concerning.

I took 14mg (on a 2 weekly schedule) 3 days ago - and wake up fasted glucose has not peaked yet.

I have also found RHR and HRV materially worsens for 2-3 days after dose, which was the motivation to stretch out to 2 weekly - which I then found improved my averages overall rather than worsening.

I was going to post separately - but I am really interested in what other people do regarding elevated blood glucose from dosing?

Clearly having elevated glucose is not ideal and I guess that is, perhaps, why Rapa paried with Arcabose does so well on longevity as it counters this downside.

@RapAdmin - I know you have experimented with different glucose lowering meds + CGM to counter this. Where did you land with respect to the optimized protocol.

I will wear a CGM for the whole 2 weekly cycle next time to get data as well.

Super interested to know who has really measured their blood glucose over the dosing cycle and where you have landed with optimal dosing cycle and additional glucose lowering meds to optimise for this.

Thanks again.