#28

Pendulumlife.com sell an Akermansia probiotic.
(Unfortunately, They don’t ship to Uk)

#29

Sold on Amazon;

For 25% off list price

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B3GF96C3?tag=bravesoftwa04-20&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=1&language=en_US

Suggestion try to grow/ferment this in half & half or light cream from these capsules. To populate your gut

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#30

FWIW

Strategies to promote abundance of Akkermansia muciniphila, an emerging probiotics in the gut, evidence from dietary intervention studies

The potential impact of a probiotic: Akkermansia muciniphila in the regulation of blood pressure—the current facts and evidence

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#31

Unfortunately, we may need the actual urolithin A supplement to get the benefits as only ~40% of us can convert berries, nuts, etc into urolithin A and this also decreases with age.

Acutely, yes. But there’s no suggestion here that the relevant organisms aren’t present through out the population, just in variable quantities. So why shouldn’t feeding them make them more populous? Testing this wouldn’t be too hard, but as far as I can tell no one has.

#32

It turns out proanthocyanidin-rich foods cause a bloom. Here they tested blueberries, cranberries, grapes and a control:

The figures are all at the bottom. I feel like they kinda missed the most exciting proanthocyanidin rich food of all: Aronia Berries.

I wish I was competent enough to upload the table comparing aronia to blackberry, strawberry, and raspberry. Aronia was 4300, next closest was blackberry at 1100, then the other 2 were around 200. You gotta love it. The answer is not to eat the bacteria, it’s to eat Aronia and yellow raspberries.

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#33

Actually, Amazentis did provide testing for a while as part of a trial… I got their package for the blood tests but got busy and didn’t sent it in (so don’t know my results). But yes, testing for something like this seems really cheap. See here: Urolithin A - Virtual Clinical Trial by Timeline Nutrition

#34

Thanks for the reference.

I like Aronia juice, it’s good and not too expensive. Generally speaking I distrust expensive “super” foods – marketing tends to overestimate the benefits.

As speculation, one might propose that what’s happening is not only that relevant polyphenols directly feed bacteria, but also that they stimulate and modify mucus secretion, which further feeds them. Perhaps elderly folks have a reduced mucus response, making things harder?

Further speculation: small amounts of oak leaves (which are free!) should improve gut health and increase UA production for not-too-old people eating a “modern American” diet. Note that too much tannin is toxic, however. I don’t know how many tests would be required to be sure if this works on any one person, but somewhere a PhD student is looking for a project.

#35

This is the line that tells the tale:

In studies investigating45
polyphenol supplementation in mice, administration of isolated PACs at levels representing 1% of the diet46
by weight was shown to increase the relative abundance of A. muciniphila from <2% to >40% within days

So within days of consuming dried blueberries (inferior by far to aronia) A. Muciniphila go from less than 2% to more than 40%. Doesn’t even seem possible. This is a massive bloom. Doesn’t seem healthy even.

I’m slowly working my way through a stash of frozen aronia berries a couple hands full per day, they are bitter and now I know why.

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#36

Decided to take advantage of Donotage’s sale and buy some Urolithin A and give it a trial.

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#37

Yes you can: method/process patents.

Securing additional patent protection usually entails obtaining claims to methods of treatment, methods of prevention or improvement, methods of maintaining health, and mechanisms of action. These paths diverge depending on whether the compound is being developed as a pharmaceutical (i.e., a drug or biologic) or a dietary supplement.

Patent protection for a pharmaceutical will usually focus on a method of treating a disease or disorder. … In contrast, method of use patent protection for a dietary supplement focuses on methods of maintaining a person’s health. The elements of dosage, timing and formulation of the composition may be included to narrow the patent claims to exactly what the innovator will be manufacturing.

However, unlike pharmaceutical drugs, the FDA will not allow the label of a dietary supplement to state that the product can be used for diagnosis, cure, mitigation, treatment or prevention of a condition or disorder; such a statement will prompt a warning letter from the FDA. For health claims to be acceptable to the FDA, the innovator must prove, with supporting scientific evidence, that the dietary supplement is intended to affect some structure or function in humans. Acceptable structure/function claims include the following: (1) a statement that claims a benefit related to a classical nutrient deficiency disease and that discloses the prevalence of such disease in the United States; (2) a statement that describes the role of a nutrient or dietary ingredient intended to affect the structure or function in humans, or characterizes the documented mechanism by which a nutrient or dietary ingredient acts to maintain such structure or function; or (3) a statement that describes the general well-being from consumption of a nutrient or dietary ingredient. 21 U.S.C. 343(r)(6).

For example, Bausch & Lomb sells the dietary supplement OCUVITE®. The product label states: “OCUVITE helps replenish essential nutrients to help protect the health of your eyes. Lutein supports macular health by helping filter harmful blue light.” While the Ocuvite label states the product is for replenishing essential nutrients for eye health, the patent marked on the product, U.S. Patent No. 6,660,297, claims:

A method for stabilizing visual acuity loss in persons with early age-related macular degeneration comprising: administering a daily dosage of not less than approximately 420 mg and not more than approximately 600 mg vitamin C, not less than approximately 400 IU and not more than approximately 540 IU vitamin E, approximately 0.04 mg to 40 mg lutein-zeaxanthine combination, not less than approximately 60 mg and not more than approximately 100 mg zinc and at least 1.6 mg and not more than approximately 2.4 mg copper.
Patent Protection for Pharmaceuticals and Dietary Supplements

Here is a recent case of a company successfully suing another company for infringing its patent on the use of beta-alanine to tincrease anaerobic working activity of muscles and other tissues.

As the DNA email notes, Amazentis has a method patent for use of UA for muscle growth; this is why DNA offered to remove all reference to muscles on their product page. Maybe that would have been enough to get them off the hook if it went to court, but DNA apparently didn’t have the budget and/or stomach to fight it out.

#38

The decision of the Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit states:

Natural Alternatives International, Inc., appeals a decision of the U.S. District Court for the Southern District of California granting Creative Compounds, LLC’s motion for judgment on the pleadings that the asserted claims of U.S. Patent Nos. 5,965,596, 7,825,084, 7,504,376, 8,993,610, 8,470,865, and RE45,947 are not patent eligible. Because Creative Compounds has failed to demonstrate under Natural Alternatives’ proposed claim constructions that the claims are not patent eligible, we reverse and remand.

Back at the district court, the parties filed a joint motion to dismiss with prejudice, in view of their settlement.

Plaintiff, Natural Alternatives International, Inc. (“NAI”), and Defendant, Creative Compounds, LLC (“Creative”) (collectively, “the Parties”), hereby move, stipulate, and agree, subject to the approval of the Court, that the present action be dismissed with prejudice pursuant to Fed. R. Civ. P. 41(a)(1)(A)(ii), in consideration of a Confidential Settlement and Release Agreement executed by the Parties. Each party will bear its own attorneys’ fees and costs.

The Court is further requested to retain jurisdiction over the matter for the purposes of enforcing the written Confidential Settlement and Release Agreement entered into between the Parties.

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#39

Your citation points to the case of Akamai Tech. v. Limelight Networks

The Federal Circuit’s analysis fundamentally misunderstands what it means to infringe a method patent. A method patent claims a number of steps; under this Court’s case law, the patent is not infringed unless all the steps are carried out. See, e.g., Aro, supra, at 344 (a “pat-ent covers only the totality of the elements in the claim and . . . no element, separately viewed, is within the grant”). This principle follows ineluctably from what a patent is: the conferral of rights in a particular claimed set of elements. “Each element contained in a patent claim is deemed material to defining the scope of the patented invention,” Warner-Jenkinson Co. v. Hilton Davis Chemical Co., 520 U. S. 17, 29 (1997) , and a patentee’s rights extend only to the claimed combination of elements, and no further.

no element, separately viewed, is within the grant So the mere mention of use, is not patent infringing.

If a company mentions the use, but not the dosage, then one element is missing. Similarly, if something is added, then the “method” is not the same. Adding vit C to beta alanine, or some other muscle supporting supplement makes the “copy” not patent infringing.

Similarly, in the Bausch and Lomb supplement, change the vit C to 1.000 mg, and change vit E to tocotrienols.

#40

Old thread but I’m wondering if anyone has identified a reliable source of Urolithin A at a lower price point than Mitopure and its competitors. Amazon is selling many such products (most also containing resveratrol and CoQ-10). Based on the relatively high percentage of nutritional products sold by Amazon that Consumer Labs finds to fail potency and/or purity tests, I’m reluctant to purchase any of these products without independent evidence. It is somewhat surprising that the major supplement providers have chosen to sell a Urolithin A product. Could this be related to Nestle’s purported rights?

#41

@RobTuck Based on my interview with Mark Tarnopolsky MD PhD, mitochondria expert, I wouldn’t bother. He says exercise is the only reliable mechanism to build healthy mitochondria.

Edit: he also said don’t bother with Urolithin A.

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#42

If you really want it, liftmode seems like a trusted brand on reddit.

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#43

Thanks for the replies. I had wondered myself whether it was worth it given that I maintain decent exercise protocols with hiking and weightlifting. My speculative reason for considering Urolithin A was to see if it might reduce my recovery interval. Now approaching 80, I find that it takes at least two full days and sometimes three to recover from a strenuous one-hour mountain hike. I can hike more often but the returns appear to me negative.

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#44

It seems to me that Urolithin is a poor man’s Rapamycin, except that Rapamycin has much more data and actually costs less per year. Am I missing something?

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#45

I forgot about this, but it increases lifespan similarly as rapamycin in Koh Tong Wey?

can-we-get-urolithin-a-in-2024-update-v0-0di36oy6ncic1
can-we-get-urolithin-a-in-2024-update-v0-0di36oy6ncic11920×1053 83.1 KB

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#46

@RobTuck I would think lowering inflammation in general would help with recovery. Also making sure you are getting enough nutrients to repair and adapt. Plus be sure to ramp up slowly so the recovery isn’t so long that you lose the adaptation benefit. Once in a while for an adventure is worth it no doubt.

#47

My inflammatory markers are about as low as they go @约瑟夫_拉维尔. I have experimented for several years to find ways to shorten beneficial exercise increased recovery time. The results have been modest. (This has been quite a contrast to my competitive running days where I trained from 20 to 60 miles a week.)

I think the length of my beneficial recovery cycles is dictated by at least one factor for certain and perhaps others I am unaware of. My LDH levels have been subnormal (95 IU/L is a typical reading) going back to my first test of it in the 1980’s. I have about 20 readings over that time span. I think low LDH and/or its genetic causes plays a role, including that my Type I muscles are atypically stronger at the end of intensive exercise than at the beginning. It is believed that intense exercise temporarily increases LDH.

As for the impacts, my experiences conform to the empirical research on men 70 years and older. The effort to benefit curve is described by an inverted-U; get to the right side of the tail and the net benefits drop. This is very different than we see in younger men. Even more depressing is that training doesn’t seem to shorten the recovery interval much. And not just in my case; others my age have reported similar experiences.

Perhaps others in my age group will report other findings and help us all figure this out. I love strenuous lower body exercises, especially hiking steep mountains and would love to be able to do more of it.

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