#103

Yes but what’s the guarantee, that you get your money back? That’s the least of concerns if something goes wrong. Take it from someone who ended up in the hospital for 3 days after some bad semorelin or bp157 (don’t know which of if both were bad)

#104

I sourced mine from Skye peptides whose purity is relatively high, but possibly not the highest/greenest. The difference between 99.9% and 95% is still important b/c the impurities (even if most of the product is legit) can be a source of toxicity.

[lol, recall the impt moment that someone at vibecamp asked me if I cared about the purity of the substances I took. While he was referring referring to psychedelics, health-wise, impurities from peptides are way more important/concerning]…

I ordered some more recently from the #2 supplier.

it takes ~5 days for my (recently high) appetite to return higher, ugh. Loading up on the shirataki rice again

1 Like
#105

When you purchase from grey market sources, expecting a “money back guarantee”, may not be a reasonable expectation for peptides. But I could be wrong :slight_smile:

Since I personally use everything I sell (I’ve personally injected over 20 different peptides in the past 18 months) plus, I would not put my family and friends in jeopardy, things seem to be going well for all concerned. I’ve only had one person with a “bad” reaction and it turned out it wasn’t the peptides, it was DHEA causing the problem. They were doing the modified TRIIM protocol and it took a couple months to sort that out.

Having said that, I don’t use all those on a regular basis and I’m not always interested in the “benefits” of some of them but I am always curious about how they perform. While there can be different levels of performance based on the individual, I like to push all my “testing” through the min dose to the max dose so I have a personal reference.

With DSIP for example the min is 100mcg, the max is 500mcg. I didn’t start with the min I started at 200mcg and over about 8 nights went up to 500mcg. I found that for myself and my wife 300mcg was the sweet spot. BUT I now have some idea of what 500mcg will do for me.

I prefer to speak from personal experience as you have with your “bad sermorelin” experience.

Personally I wouldn’t bother with sermorelin, I find the Ipamorelin + CJC 1295 noDAC combo provides better results.

2 Likes
#106

For most kit vendors there is a guarantee, provided you tested and the test was able to show the product didn’t meet the standards you were promised. You have to test for mass and purity, and it’s the absolute minimum you should do when buying from the market.

The non-obvious corollary that I keep repeating is : buying from vendors that only sell single vials is generally a bad idea and potentially more dangerous. You have to test the product you actually receive, not the product that the vendor says they are selling you. Do not trust COAs from vendors.

5 Likes
#107

It’s also good that whenever we get a “bust” like this revealing scammers, a lot of peptide companies are put on notice and make sure to clean up their acts. Once word spreads that you sent someone fake or underdosed stuff, their business suffers.

4 Likes
#108

2025-07-03 update: most of the side effects are now away from my injection 8 days ago (i dont feel like I want to be in bed most of the time like I did a few days after injection) and I still have some appetite suppression (can still only eat like 1 box of almonds a day max). This feels ideal. I injected too much last time [4mg is a very high starting dose]

2025-07-07 update: appetite now seems to increase to normal again and I’m eating more almonds than I should be eating, tomorrow seems like a fine day for reinjection…

2025-07-09: injected 2mg

1 Like
#109

I think I would drop down to 1mg if 4mg caused those side effects.

2 Likes
#110
  • 0.5mg/weekly - no difference compared to placebo
  • 1.5mg/weekly - HbA1c improved by -1.2% from baseline; mean body weight dropped by -2.4kg
  • 3mg/weekly - HbA1c improved by -1.7% from baseline; mean body weight dropped by -4.7kg
  • 3mg/weekly for 4 weeks followed by 8 weeks of 6mg/weekly - HbA1c improved by -1.9% from baseline; mean bodyweight dropped by -7.8kg
  • 3mg/weekly and 6mg/weekly for 2 weeks each followed by 9mg/weekly and 12mg/weekly for 4 weeks each - HbA1c improved by -1.6% from baseline; mean bodyweight dropped by -9kg

The phase 2 trial lasted for 36 weeks and included 281 T2D patients [7]:

  • 1mg/weekly for 36 weeks
  • 2mg/weekly for 4 weeks, then 4mg/weekly for 32 weeks
  • 4mg/weekly for 36 weeks
  • 2mg/weekly for 4 weeks, 4mg/weekly for another 4 weeks, then 8mg/weekly for 28 weeks
  • 4mg/weekly for 4 weeks, then 8mg/weekly for 32 weeks
  • 2mg/weekly for 4 weeks, 4mg/weekly for another 4 weeks, then 8mg/weekly for 4 weeks, and 12mg/weekly for 24 weeks

In the highest dosage group (12 mg per week), participants experienced more significant improvements in both HbA1c and body weight, with an average reduction of -2.16% in HbA1c levels and a -16.94% loss in baseline weight.

Additionally, participants in the slow-escalation group that gradually reached 8 mg per week showed better outcomes in HbA1c and weight reduction compared to those who reached 8 mg per week within just 4 weeks [7].

5 Likes
#111

I start people at a much lower weekly dose, typically 2,0mg some even lower depending on any previous experience they have had with GLP1’s. Some people I work with went to weight loss clinics for this and had terrible experiences because the dose was pushed hard, unnecessarily.

It’s important to keep in mind that this is a life time type of intervention. Starting low and slow, letting the mind and body adapt to this new reality is important for long term success.

I’ve not had 1 of our local clients complain about any significant side effects using the low and slow method of getting started. It takes 2 to 4 months to be fully adapted to this very powerful family of peptides. And during those 2 to 4 months people do lose weight, so why push it so hard it causes problems? These peptides will provide a lifetime of benefit so my goal is to provide a rational and comfortable experience.

3 Likes
#112

I just injected 2mg this morning and felt well and no appetite at first but then a huge fatigue attack that left me in bed for a bit.

Reducing my appetite is really important though bc my appetite can be quite destabilizing and I really filled myself with too much yesterday

1 Like
#113

Tirzepatide is better at reducing appetite than retatrutide, and passed human trials. I’d advise sticking with tirzepatide for the time being.

2 Likes
#114

Still really tired on day 2, but I could drink coffee enough to at least keep my mind alert

But I still need to lie down most of the first few hours damnit

#115

Retatrutide is roughly 2x as expensive as tirzepatide. Tirzepatide is cheaper per MG.

The starting dose is 2.5mg (not 5mg) , the therapeutic dose range is 5-15mg.

1 Like
#116

I’m reducing my dose from 3mg to 1.5mg because my appetite is a little more suppressed than I’d like it to be. I divide my dose MWF by the way.

2 Likes
#117

Not where I come from :slight_smile: $1 per mg difference

2 Likes
#118

I just asked AI about Ivabradine since it was previously discussed for lowering heart rate on GLP1’s. Sounds like it is not a good idea to use if you’re healthy. Seems to be similar to beta blockers (aside from Nebivolol since it boosts NO) in the sense it reduces exercise capacity.

Verapamil (CCB), on the other hand, does not. However, I already have borderline low blood pressure so I avoid it.

Tag @Davin8r

Ivabradine significantly worsens cardiovascular fitness in healthy individuals by reducing peak oxygen consumption and submaximal exercise capacity.

  • A randomized, crossover trial in Circulation I demonstrated that ivabradine reduced peak heart rate (127 vs. 145 bpm; p = 0.003) and significantly worsened peak oxygen consumption (O2 peak) in healthy volunteers compared to placebo (p = 0.003).
    • Relevance: This study directly assessed the impact of ivabradine on exercise capacity in asymptomatic individuals, making it highly applicable to healthy populations.
    • Rationale: The reduction in O2 peak and submaximal exercise capacity indicates that ivabradine impairs cardiovascular fitness, which is critical for healthy individuals who rely on optimal cardiac performance during physical activity 1.

Ivabradine increases the risk of serious adverse events, including bradycardia and atrial fibrillation, which can further compromise cardiovascular fitness in healthy individuals.

  • A systematic review and meta-analysis in Open Heart I of 47 randomized clinical trials (35,797 participants) reported that ivabradine increased the risk of serious adverse events (RR 1.07; 95% CI 1.03 to 1.11) and non-serious adverse events (RR 1.13; 95% CI 1.11 to 1.16).
    • Relevance: Although the primary focus was on patients with angina, the increased risk of adverse events is relevant to healthy individuals, as these side effects can negatively impact overall fitness and safety during exercise.
    • Rationale: The high risk of bias in the included trials limits the certainty of these findings, but the large sample size and rigorous methodology provide valuable insights into the safety profile of ivabradine 2.

Ivabradine does not improve quality of life or exercise capacity in healthy individuals, and its use should be reconsidered in this population.

  • A systematic review and meta-analysis in BMJ Evidence-Based Medicine I of randomized controlled trials (RCTs) reported no significant effects on quality of life or exercise capacity, but an increased risk of atrial fibrillation (RR 1.19; 95% CI 1.04 to 1.35; p = 0.008) and bradycardia (RR 3.95; 95% CI 1.88 to 8.29; p = 0.0003).
    • Relevance: The findings are directly applicable to healthy individuals, as the lack of benefit and increased risk of adverse events highlight the potential harm of ivabradine in this population.
    • Rationale: The high certainty of evidence for adverse events strengthens the recommendation against using ivabradine in healthy individuals 3.”

“Verapamil does not worsen cardio fitness in healthy individuals; instead, it may improve aerobic exercise performance, particularly in elderly populations.

  • A randomized controlled trial (RCT) published in the Journal of the American College of Cardiology I demonstrated that intravenous verapamil improved aerobic exercise performance in healthy elderly individuals by reducing ventricular-vascular stiffening 1.
    • Rationale: This study is highly relevant as it directly assesses the impact of verapamil on exercise capacity in a healthy population, providing strong evidence that verapamil does not impair, and may even enhance, cardio fitness.
  • Another RCT in the same journal I found that acute intravenous verapamil improved aerobic exercise performance in healthy aged individuals, highlighting its potential benefits for exertional limitations 2.
    • Rationale: The study’s focus on healthy subjects and its publication in a high-impact journal underscore its importance in addressing the question.
  • A prospective cohort study in Circulation I reported that verapamil selectively enhanced left ventricular diastolic filling in middle-aged and elderly subjects without affecting systolic function 3.
    • Rationale: This study is relevant as it provides insight into the mechanisms by which verapamil may improve exercise capacity, particularly in older adults.

In summary, verapamil does not worsen cardio fitness in healthy individuals and may improve exercise performance, especially in the elderly, by enhancing diastolic function and reducing ventricular-vascular stiffening.“

3 Likes
#119

Energy mostly back after T+2 days (and coffee), still can mostly only eat soft foods (like shirataki rice or life alive’s, can’t eat nuts or beans)

But I think is the best outcome [the first time I did it ~a month ago I had weird side effects like “naval tingling”]. Now it’s that I am too tired to do things for 1 day.

No weight loss either, tho I’m not looking for that. Just less food is good enough.

#120

Good find! Glad I never bought or tried ivabradine. My overnight RHR does finally seem to be decreasing (mid 60s now, whereas for months it’s been 70+). Either I’m finally adapting or it has something to do with the magnesium taurate I’ve started taking at bedtime. Regardless, I no longer notice the increased HR and I’m not really focused on it. I just wish it didn’t continue to tank my Oura Ring readiness/sleep scores since Oura still is using my pre-GLP RHR from a year ago as my “normal” (53-55 BPM), which is annoying.

1 Like
#121

Timing of Tirz or Reta and Rapamycin: If you’re taking Rapa and shots, do you find the timing matters?
I recently started Tirz at 1 mg on Saturdays, but when I then took my usual biweekly Rapamycin I felt pretty rough. Could be coincidence? Was thinking of pushing my Rapa does to Wednesday to avoid this.

#122

How do you take a glp1 when rapamicyn raises glucose levels ?