#61

No mention from the dentist on the need to take both. But I am sure I am getting plenty of both with my current protein intake.

#62

so you were told or read to take leucine ? u are the only one who has ever said that. all others say lysine which i have started taking and seems to be helping a little but of course no ā€˜miracle cureā€™.

#63

are u saying u gave it to some dogs at that rate and they all died or at least one died?

#64

was it by injections to the dogs or oral or what method?

#65

If you spread out the dose (e.g., 5mg) over a couple days, the likelihood of sores seem to lessen (for me anyway). However, this begs the question of whether it is really beneficial to spike the dose one weekly to achieve benefit vs. multiple lower doses. I donā€™t recall any animal or other data that addresses this.

#66

I initially got chronic canker sores (aphthous ulcers) from Rapamycin. They came and went for many months before I found the cause and a really helpful treatment.

I have had my canker sores under good control for the last six months, after suffering badly for about nine months. The sources of my treatments comes from a lot of trial and error research and suggestions from various pundits, including Dr Peter Attia.

The biggest breakthrough was when I changed from the major brand toothpastes, which mostly use an ingredient called sodium lauryl sulphate (SLS). SLS is a surfactant also used in household soaps and detergents. It creates a bubbly foamy effect. It seems totally superficial but apparently makes your teeth ā€œfeelā€ cleaner. SLS is rated as a high hazard for mouth irritation and a moderate irritation for your organs.

Go figure why itā€™s allowed in toothpaste! Since I changed toothpastes, Iā€™ve had only minor irritations. And none of the ā€œalmost comic painā€ described by Peter Attia when he had canker sores.

Learned dentists recommend not using toothpastes with SLS if you are sensitive to any form of mouth sore. Itā€™s superfluous to good dental hygiene.

SLS is absent in Dr Bronners and Sensodyne toothpastes. I prefer the former as itā€™s also absent fluoride - i think we get enough of this as an additive in drinking water and dental cleaning.

Hereā€™s a link to Dr Bronnerā€™s peppermint toothpaste. Peter Attia also recommend Dr Bronnerā€™s. Sensodyne is ok if you want the fluoride.

The producers of Blistex have a useful product called Kanka. I found that this helps with established canker sores. It reduces the inflammation and deadens the pain to help you avoid irritating it further when eating. Some of my early canker sores lasted 14 miserable days.

For completeness, these treatments did not work for me: red light devices, alum powder, saltwater rinses, baking powder, honey, Hydrogen peroxide, coconut oil or Milk of magnesia.

I hope that most of you can find the same relief as I have from these treatments and by discarding toothpastes with SLS.

Good luck.

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VO2max: A Significant Increase via Sublingual Rapamycin?
#67

In the video with Matt, David Sabatini, and Attia, David offhand mentions that if you take something that simply does something (Iā€™d have to listen again to figure out what it was) in the form of a mouthwash before dosing then you will never have a mouth sore. He doesnā€™t say what it is. Nobody asks him. Thanks, guys.

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#68

Yes, I heard the comment from David Sabatini. I thought he was making a hypothetical assessment. I donā€™t think the substance he was describing was currently available.

Simply avoiding toothpastes with sodium lauryl sulphate (SLS). has reduced my mouth ulcers dramatically.

Dr Bronner, I salute you!

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#69

This is great info. I just checked, and it turns out the toothpaste I use for my nitric oxide support specifically mentions no SLS. What luck !

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#70

I use Xylitol toothpaste and it mentions no SLS. I usually donā€™t have mouth sores. Could be due to the paste I use.

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#71

My partner recently got a very hurting mouth sore on rapamycin. Now she took a gel with choline salicylate in it (called mundisal gel in Austria). And she ist very happy with it. The pain was significantly reduced immediately after rubbing it on. Pain relieve continues for several hours. Within two days the sore has nearly resolved.

Edit: In hindsight ā€œresolvedā€ was a too strong statement. The ā€œopenā€ wound healed within two days. The sore itself took another 5 days to go away.

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#72

Thank you! For those, living in EU: Zendium is gentle on the mouth | Unilever Zendium :

Zendium is SLS-free

Zendiumā€™s formulation has been specially designed without sodium lauryl sulphate (SLS). Instead, it contains a mild, low-foaming agent called stereath-30, which protects the delicate soft tissues of the mouth and also helps to maintain the integrity of the enzymes and proteins in Zendium toothpaste.

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#73

Itā€™s so easy to prevent mouth sores - simply reduce the dose of rapamycin :blush:

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#74

what is the best rinse or topical to clear up the sores? I cannot eat

#75

Salty water rinse is the best. Stop taking Rapa for a few days, decrease the dose, increase intervals to avoid mouth sores.

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#76

Debacterol is supposed to be one of the best treatmentsā€¦

But you need a doctorā€™s prescription I think:

#77

thank you I will ask my dr to call this in for me- do the mouth sores go away with time on the Rapa?

#78

They will go away and sometimes pretty soon if you adjust your dose correctly. I never have them bc I calibrated my dose for my needs. With rapamycin itā€™s ā€œone dose doesnā€™t fit allā€ case.

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#79

Yes, generally, but most people donā€™t get them and they vary a lot between individuals. I had one mouth sore once at around 4mg/week, it went away within about 4 days and Iā€™ve never had one again, despite testing doses as high as 28mg in a week.

So its a really individual sort of thingā€¦ your experience may be very different from other people here. see the list of side effects people experience (at least once) here: Side Effects of Rapamycin (part 2)

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#80

Super frustrated. New to taking rapamycin. Started 1 mg a week, then took 2 mg and had 1 small canker, went away quickly. Then next week dosed at 4 mg and had several cankers leading me to delay dose at day 7. Took 3mg at day 9 and had had multiple painful cankers that affected my ability to eat and brush my teeh. Using Sensodyne, no SLS. Used OTC Kanka and had Rx for topical clobetasol gel (steroid) to apply with a gauze pad. I am now at 14 days and my cankers are finally gone. Not sure what I will try next. 2 mg a week? Frustrated by my bad cankers. For reference I am 125 lbs and 59 years old. Not sure if this is an issue as far as excessive mTORC1 suppression? Not sure if 2 mg/week is enough. I have atherosclerosis/single coronary artery stent with a normal lipid profile. I think inflammation was the cause. 15 years ago my hsCRP was 4.5 and no doctor said a word to me about cardiovascular risk. Now my hsCRP is 0.7 before starting Rapaā€¦

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