I’ll let others do their own research but the evidence, despite it being a social fad on TikTok, etc.:
“borax is dangerous to ingest and isn’t a safe source of boron”

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BobinUK will obviously know more, but The Borax Conspiracy paper says the laundry version is fine. It felt strange buying it but I have started mixing 1 teaspoon in 750mls of water and having a splash of this in the bottom of a glass every day. So far so good :slight_smile:

Thanks AnUser,

I don’t disagree but can’t help but feel that we are all guessing about safe levels with this. I hope to get time today to research more on cofactors.

So the vegan D you take is D3? That is interesting - I thought that D made from irradiating fungi (maybe this is different than lichen) was Ergocalciferol or D2.

Thanks Potionology,

That is what would seem logical I agree, but from what I can gather we make quite a lot of Vitamin D from sun exposure. I am not really concerned about that being toxic but did think it might be interesting if it might play a part in sun stroke etc.

Many will disagree with with what I am about to say, sure, but I have never used sunscreen and through the part of the year that the sun is high enough to make vitamin D I try and get some sun in the middle of the day every day it is clear and the sun not behind clouds. I am very cautious however not to sit in sun behind clouds or harsh winter sun (beyond warming myself for some IR) or sun behind glass. In other words I like sun with that nice bite that tells me I am getting UVB and not just UVA. I also am very careful not to expose my skin to wind. While I did get a bit of loose skin on my face after losing a lot of weight 2 years ago - my skin tone is very even with few blemishes and I am often complimented on it. I have less spots and freckles than I did as a child. I don’t overdo it of course, but by mid summer I always have a good tan.

You haven’t commented on the study where people randomized to 60 000 IU vitamin D3 monthly had a 29% increase in death rate compared to placebo.

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I take 5 mg, but never noticed the form until now. It says from Boron Citrate. Maybe I should switch to the mule team.

Personally I fail to see the benefit of switching from Boron Citrate supplement to Borax

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I was 72 ng/ml in my latest round of testing. But I wildly overshot B-12 (1691 with 1100 being the upper band).

FWIW

I have taken/ take Vitamins D in high doses{50,000 IU to 80,000IU) on and off. A few times 100,000IU for several months.

I would recommend reading;

“How Not To Die With True High-Dose Vitamin D Therapy: Coimbra’s Protocol and the Secrets of Safe High-Dose Vitamin D3 and Vitamin K2 Supplementation”

https://www.amazon.com/True-High-Dose-Vitamin-Therapy-Supplementation/dp/1983353248/ref=asc_df_1983353248/

This book is about Coimbra’s Protocol, Dr. Coimbra has treated thousands of patients.

The point i was making is that extremely high doses of D3 have caused death.

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At a guess 1 teaspoon is about 5 grams of borax. Borax is a pesticide and there will be a point at which the dose is too high. Domestic use was banned in the uk. The boron i take is admittedly boric acud, but only 3mg. The 3mg is boron whereas your 5g is borax, but you are taking more than i would risk. Some of borax is sodium supplementation as well. Be careful about the sodium potassium balance.

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Yes… 100% Borsx as in your 20 mule Team, but strangely enough it is restricted in England and many European countries, not because its harming people but more likely because they are healing…

Borax is banned from being sold as a cleaner because of concerns about reproductive health. I have not researched the background to this. However, i dont mind doing so. I live in the uk and buy boric acid supplements off amazon. So boron in quantities which are safe to consume is not banned.

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I thought I would spend a bit of time looking for papers on what dose of Boron/Borax can potentially be dangerous. I have glanced at “The Borax Conspiracy” which talks about Rex Newman taking 30mg of Borax per day. That is probably only a little bit more elemental Boron than the Boric Acid I take at 3mg of elemental Boron.

Obviously fatal doses vary between people. I found more deaths reported from Boron/Borate/Boric Acid poisoning than I found from over use of Vitamin D.

When eating the pesticide and cleaner Borax there are different versions with more or less water initially added. That will affect how hazardous this is.

I found one person who committed suicide by eating Boric Acid Crystals as well as all the cases in the review paper. (which I copy below)

4.2. Fatalities after human skin exposure
A 4-month-old girl was treated for dermatitis (“diaper rash”) for 1
week with boric acid ointment; but, as this did not relieve the symptoms,
she was further bathed in a boric acid solution and had her skin intermittently dusted with boric acid crystals. These latter treatments were
done over the next 2 weeks. The rash worsened, and the treatment with
boric acid was discontinued; the infant began having loose stools, and a
sore throat was treated with Argyrols (silver) and Vicks ointment
(containing several ingredients). The child developed difficulty breathing and was hospitalised. A range of signs and symptoms ensued, and
eventually the infant died. The blood level of boric acid was 22 mg/L
(3.9 mg B/L). The cerebrospinal fluid contained 50 mg boric acid/L (8.8
mg B/L). The tissue levels of boric acid were 36.8 mg B/kg (kidney),
17.5 mg B/kg (liver), 2.1 mg B/kg (brain), and 1.9 mg B/kg (muscle)—
levels considerably higher than the normal human levels presented in
Fig. 1. The 4-month-old twin brother of the former case was also hospitalised due to the same treatment regimen. The symptoms included
diarrhoea, vomiting and dehydration; his blood level of boric acid was
18.8 mg/L (3.3 mg B/L) and the urine level was 30 mg/L (5.3 mg B/L).
He eventually recovered (Ducey and Williams, 1953). A 35-year-old
woman who had varicose veins for a number of years treated a generalised rash for 14 days with wet dressings saturated with boric acid
solution. Some 11 days into the regimen, she became lethargic and
subsequently comatose; she later died. Her boric acid levels were as
follows: 138 mg B/kg (liver), 121 mg B/kg (brain), 166 mg B/kg (spinal
fluid), 919 mg B/kg (urine) and 613 mg B/kg (blood). These values are
considerably higher than the normal levels presented in Fig. 1 (Jordan
and Crissey, 1957). A 7-month-old infant died after being treated for
eczema for several days with dressings containing 3% boric acid. The
level of boric acid in bodily fluids and tissues were as follows: 44 mg
B/kg serum, 35 mg B/kg bile, 32 mg B/kg gastrointestinal tract contents,
21 mg B/kg brain, 18 mg B/kg kidney, 22 mg B/kg liver, and 32 mg B/kg
spleen (Kaufmann et al., 1962). A 9-month-old girl was admitted to the
hospital after having been treated for dermatitis (diaper rash) with boric
acid. She had erythema and excoriation of the skin; she had become
lethargic and semicomatose, with vomiting and high fever. A number of
additional symptoms were observed after hospitalisation, including
dehydration, cyanosis, and convulsions. She became comatose, and died
26 h after hospitalisation. Her boron tissue levels were 210 mg B/kg in
whole blood, 200 in serum, 240 in brain, 290 in liver, 280 in kidney, 220
in heart, 370 in thymus, 340 in muscle, and 30 in adipose tissue (Brooke
and Boogs, 1951).

5.2. Acute toxicity case studies with fatalities after ingestion of boric acid
Wong et al. described an accidental poisoning in which 5 of 11 infants died after ingesting infant formulae prepared from a bottle of
“distilled” water that accidently contained 2.5% boric acid. The amounts
of ingested borate was between 2 and 14 g—with a mean level in those
who died of 8.5 g borate (1.5 g B = 500 mg B/kg bw), and in those who
survived approximately 170 mg B/kg bw. The symptoms included central nervous system irritation; vomiting and diarrhoea; as well as erythema, exfoliation, and desquamation of the skin (Wong et al., 1964). A
man aged 77 years had ingested approximately 30 g of boric acid (~76
mg B/kg bw). He developed vomiting and diarrhoea, and acute renal
failure was suspected. He died from cardiac insufficiency (Ishii et al.,
1993). One man aged 45 years ingested approximately two cups of boric
acid crystals in a suicide attempt. He shortly thereafter experienced
nausea, vomiting, diarrhoea, and dehydration. After 2 days, he was
hospitalised with generalised erythematous rash, hypotension, renal
failure, and metabolic acidosis. He developed cardiac symptoms and
died. Fifty-two hours after ingestion his blood level of boric acid was 74
mg B/L and the urine level was 280 mg B/L (Restuccio et al., 1992). An
18-month-old girl died after accidently ingesting a pesticide that contained boric acid. The post-mortem examination showed cerebral
oedema and pulmonary congestion and oedema. The concentration of
borate in her heart blood was 14.6 mg B/L, and the concentration in the
gastric contents was 1060 mg B/L (Hamilton and Wolf, 2007). A male
infant 5 days of age had ingested 6–9 g boric acid (~300–500 mg B/kg
bw). He was irritable, hyperactive, and had erythema. Subsequently,
vomiting, central nervous system depression and desquamation of the
skin ensued; he became anuric and died (Segar, 1960).

Here are the EU Chemicals Agency reports

https://echa.europa.eu/registration-dossier/-/registered-dossier/15357

https://echa.europa.eu/registration-dossier/-/registered-dossier/15472/7/11/1

The first case is a 66 year-old man following the accidental ingestion of 1 to 1.5 oz of borax (sodium borate) powder mistaken for a saline cathartic and a second case in 1928 of a fatality in a 53-year-old woman following the ingestion of four pancakes made from flour containing 51% sodium borate. The authors found that the majority of acute boric acid ingestions produce no toxicity and that boric acid ingestions produce minimal toxicity at serum boric acid levels of 340 ug/mL or less. A review of previously reported cases indicate that much higher blood levels are well tolerated (Litovitz et al. 1988).

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Incidentally when people eat Borax it turns into Boric acid and Sodium Chloride in the stomach. (plus some water).

Boron Citrate is different being C6H5BO7. I have not found how that reacts in the stomach, but various papers say Boron mainly exists as Boric Acid in Homo Sapiens.

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Thanks Joseph - I will check this out, always interested to learn more!

You could just start by reading the PDF BobinUK posted. :upside_down_face:

What have I said that you disagree with?

I have said that there is evidence that some people have died from excess Boron. I have glanced at the PDF and in fact I quote from it where it says that the Australian Rex Newman took 30mg of Borax every day. You seem to be taking 100 times as much. (edit - I note that I misread the original post)

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Actually to be fair I have reread both the PDF and your post. I misread your post as saying you had a teaspoon of borax in 750ml and drank that each day. Instead you are taking only part of it. (a splash)

That is a slightly higher concentration than recommended in the paper which has a teaspoon in 1 litre and people take only 5ml. (which is about a quarter of a shot measure in the UK which is 20ml).

In the end if you follow the instructions in the PDF you end up doing the same as taking a Boron supplement of 3mg.

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Yes I know, I wonder still about your comments on the study showing 60 000 IU a month increasing death rate, that is not a high blood level of vitamin D, I am pretty sure.