#204

Astaxanthin (Ast) is an effective neuroprotective and antioxidant compound used to treat Alzheimer’s disease (AD); however, the underlying in vivo molecular mechanisms remain unknown. In this study, we report that Ast can activate the mammalian target of rapamycin (mTOR) pathway in the 8-month-old APP/PS1 transgenic mouse model of AD. Our results suggest that Ast could ameliorate the cognitive defects in APP/PS1 mice by activating the mTOR pathway. Moreover, mTOR activation perturbed the mitochondrial dynamics, increased the synaptic plasticity after 21 days of treatment with Ast (10 mg/kg/day), and increased the expression of Aβ-degrading enzymes, mitochondrial fusion, and synapse-associated proteins and decreased the expression of mitochondrial fission proteins. Intraperitoneal injection of the mTOR inhibitor, rapamycin, abolished the effects of Ast. In conclusion, Ast activates the mTOR pathway, which is necessary for mitochondrial dynamics and synaptic plasticity, leading to improved learning and memory. Our results support the use of Ast for the treatment of cognitive deficits.

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#205

Meaning that you should not combine Astaxanthin with Rapamycin? or not take them combined the same day?

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#206

Ive been taking astaxanthin for years before rapamycin, take them together now and have seen no side effects

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#207

I don’t think this paper talk about side effects, but it suspects Astaxanthin and Rapamycin to cancel each other out. one activates Mtor and the other deactivates it. At least this is what I understand about it. If your goal is to inhibit Mtor then I would stay away from Astaxanthin the days you take Rapamycin.

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#208

I reviewed scientific studies on mechanism of action of Astaxanthin and clinical applications. I don’t think it’s proven that Astaxanthin effect is caused by Mtor activation.
For ex. Astaxanthin modulation of signaling pathways that regulate autophagy

SH Kim, H Kim - Marine Drugs, 2019 - mdpi.com

… The fact that the activation of AMPK promotes autophagy via mTOR inhibition and direct
activation of the ULK1 complex suggests that astaxanthin may modulate the induction of …

If Astaxanthin works by stimulating Mtor pathway, there is a big question about taking Rapamycin for prevention of cognitive impairment.

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#209

That sounds like a reasonable approach given the data we have. But as @macneu2299 mentioned, there seems to be disagreement in the research about the mechanism of action of astaxanthin in terms of the different benefits it provides, so it seems we are still learning and the research is early.

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#210

I take both Astaxanthin and Rapamycin and I can tell you that taking Astaxanthin does nothing to reduce the side effects of Rapamycin. Therefore I would say it does not block the effects of Rapamycin. I believe that Rapamycin effectively blocks MTOR activation from any other supplements. If anything, Rapa may render Astaxanthin less effective.

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#211

I would think an inhibitor would generally be more likely to have any impact than an enhancer. It would be able to inhibit I would think a similar proportion of an enhanced activity.

#212

We need ITP to test Rapa + Astaxanthin ASAP!

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#213

Astaxnathin and AMPK Signaling

The effect of the antioxidant astaxanthin on AMPK signaling has not been extensively studied. However, the findings from the few studies that have been reported indicate that astaxanthin acts as a positive AMPK regulator. Specifically, astaxanthin was observed to inhibit lipogenesis and fat accumulation in the liver and to inhibit hepatic apoptosis in oleic acid-induced hepatic steatosis [88]. Astaxanthin’s anti-steatotic properties are attributed to its ability to activate AMPK signaling, as reflected by the observed increase in the ratio of phosphorylated vs unphosphorylated AMPK (p-AMPK/AMPK). Astaxanthin-induced AMPK activation was found to negatively regulate lipogenesis and promote fatty acid oxidation [88]. Furthermore, it has been shown that the intake of esterified astaxanthin that was extracted from Haematococcus pluvialis increases the running time of mice to exhaustion as a result of the increased level of total AMPK in the skeletal muscle [89]. The fact that the activation of AMPK promotes autophagy via mTOR inhibition and direct activation of the ULK1 complex suggests that astaxanthin may modulate the induction of autophagy.

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#214

@Maveric78

Conclusions: Supplementation with 12 mg⋅day-1 astaxanthin for 7 days provided an ergogenic benefit to 40 km cycling time trial performance in recreationally trained male cyclists and enhanced whole-body fat oxidation rates in the final stages of this endurance-type performance event.

and

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#215

what about the synthetic which is much more affordable vs natural as i read on internet.
’ Is all astaxanthin the same?
Synthetic Astaxanthin. While their names might be the same, these two ingredients couldn’t be more different. Synthetic astaxanthin makes up more than 99% of the global astaxanthin market, which is hardly surprising considering it is much cheaper and easier to produce than natural astaxanthin.Feb 16, 2021’

what do you pay for something that worked :?

#216

yes… see this thread Astaxanthin, Natural vs. Synthetic - Your Thoughts?

#217

Hi Dan, Synthetic astaxanthin is petrochemically sourced and I don’t think this source has been approved for human consumption by regulatory bodies? I think it’s most often used for fish farm feeds, to give the red color in salmon and shrimp. Natural astaxanthin is usually sourced from bluegreen or microalgae and it’s commonly thought to deliver higher quality muscle and skeletal growth in the farmed fish. Of course, fish in the wild only get natural astaxanthin. As I understand it, synthetic astaxanthin has been designed to be as close as possible to the natural astaxanthin compound.

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#218

That may be true for some types of astaxanthin, but its not true for many. See this thread on Synthetic astaxanthin. Its actually the synthetic astaxanthin that was used in the National Instiatutes of Health ITP studies and that had a 12% median lifespan improvement benefit. ( so it seems at least some synthetic astaxanthin may be better than natural, and its a fraction of the cost of the natural stuff).

See details here: Astaxanthin, Natural vs. Synthetic - Your Thoughts?

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#219

Yes, I’m familiar with the ITP study using synthetic astaxanthin, so it’s clearly efficacious.

However, that does not mean it’s better than natural astaxanthin.

No ITP trials have yet been done on the natural version. It would be interesting to see the ITP using natural astaxanthin in a trial to see if it’s better or worse? I suspect both compounds will have very similar results.

The synthetic version is sourced from ancient organic life converted over millions of years into convenient, but unsustainable, fossil fuels. The other is “farmed” from natural organisms, and that is unfortunately a little more costly than the massively subsidized oil industries.

How much longer will petro-chemical sourced products be a viable and ethical option? It’s only cheaper because it’s a byproduct of the mass production and processes that relate to our addiction to fossel fuels.

We cannot always look at “cheaper” just from the point of view of the shelf price at Amazon.

Keep in mind that natural astaxanthin is one of the few non-perscription products, approved for human consumption, that increased longevity in the ITP studies.

Unlike rapamycin, this means we can all get access to it.

Overall, if the ITP study holds up in humans, then the 9% increase in longevity is amazing, and I think it’s worth paying the relatively small differential for a sustainable natural product.

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#220

A number of the people on this thread appear to have been taking astaxanthin for some time (many years, in some cases). Have you noticed benefits from taking it? Or are you taking it because the ITP showed it prolongs mice lives but don’t sense any direct benefits (even if there might be benefits occurring)? As I explain below, I am asking because I am seriously considering taking it.

o. less sun damage (I believe marathon runners used to take it)? — this seems like it could be easy to prove assuming it doesn’t bioaccumulate substantially. And this is the main reason I am interested.

o. Fights atherosclerosis? No idea how to prove this — change in CAC scores???

o. Fights inflammation — maybe feeling of sore joints when on/off it?

o. Improves cognitive function — I’ve seen some on this forum say something to the tune of “I felt sharper” on a variety of supplements/drugs.

o. Improves vision: vision test could be easy. More easily reading small print, etc.

o. Improves male fertility (this is a negative side effect because I don’t need another tuition payment) — I’m not sure I want to test this.

Etc.

Seriously, this list of benefits reads like an ad for longevity/health snake oil.

I am curious if anyone has “sensed” positive changes in their health from astaxanthin? (With the understanding that most people here are taking many supplements per day — including weekly/biweekly Rapamycin — and wouldn’t necessarily know which supplement caused the benefit).

It seems though that there are many supplements discussed (not just here: everywhere) and then get “popular” and many people take it and discuss it. Then after some time talk dies down and there are few mentions of it at all. It seems to have fallen off many people’s “stacks”. Or maybe I’m being unfair.

I just ran across astaxanthin (I apologize that I appear to be 6-12 months behind the pack here in most things). I am seriously considering taking it (in a 4-12mg pill dose) because I plan to do a great deal of hiking this summer and don’t want the sun damage (and don’t feel like night hiking as it doesn’t work in my schedule most days). I came to this from hearing marathon runners take it for sun exposure, and there seem to be basically no side effects at 4-12mg daily so low risk/reward for my goal. Also then I started seeing the myriad of benefits listed, albeit with more tenuous research certainty. I’m not yet taking Rapamycin (but might order it this summer) so enhancing MTOR on inhibition days isn’t yet an issue although I plan several four-day fasts which might overlap.

Also, I prefer to keep my “stack” more minimal — not rigid, but “economical”. For instance, I took GlyNAC for 9 months, didn’t sense any changes, and just this last week ditched the NAC (but kept the glycine) — maybe there were positive changes but none that I could tell (someone mentioned that I may not yet be old enough to benefit; also I read a Chinese paper [enough said] that suggested NAC caused accelerated knee osteoarthritis). Perhaps this is a bad policy?

Thank you for your thoughts on this.

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#221

I take astaxanthin because there appears to be evidence that it has merit. However, i have no personal data i can say are caused by it.

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#222

I notice nothing from astaxanthin, apart from less sun burn and more easy tanning. But, that is enough for me to continue with it.

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#223

Thank you, @GoldenCB — that’s definitely enough for me to start it.

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