This paper was pointed out to me. Although from quite a while ago it was interesting. They missed some key things particularly the link between mitochondria (via citrate and acetyl-CoA) and gene expression and also the need to protect the mitochondrial DNA.

I thought people might like to see the paper, however. It has some interesting examples of unusual species aging processes.

Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences - 2006 - SKULACHEV - Aging as a Mitochondria‐Mediated Atavistic Program Can.pdf (220.1 KB)

5 Likes

Looking in this paper I find reference to some research I was not aware of. These are IMO expected conclusions, but I have not seen them previously as cited research. When I get the time, which may be soon, I will try hunting down the references.

Later, Pierpaoli succeeded in demonstrating that (1) substitution of pineal gland in old mice by that from the young mice prolongs life whereas the old-to young substitution has the opposite effect, (2) transplantation of the old pineal gland to thymus of a young mouse shortens the life span, (3) removal of pineal gland on the fourteenth month of the life has an effect similar to substitution of old pineal
gland in young mice, (4) the nocturnal treatment of old mice with melatonin is favorable for longevity (see Pierpaoli, this volume).83–88

The above is in a section looking at hormonal control of aging. As people know I think the role of melatonin here is not hormonal control, but anti-oxidant protection of mtDNA. The experimental results, however, remain valid notwithstanding the errors in assumed mechanism.

I have also extracted this section that was interesting

As was noticed by Wallace and Weismann, some of organisms of this kind are
constructed in a way predetermining death shortly after reproduction. For instance,
imagos of mayflies die within a few days since they cannot eat due to lack of functional mouth and their intestines are filled with air.2 In the mite Adactilidium, the
young hatch inside the mother’s body and eat their way out.50 The male of some
squids dies just after transferring his spermatophore to a female.51 The female octopus stops eating when her children are hatched. This does not occur if her optical
glands are removed. Such an operation results in a four-fold increase in life span of
the animal.52 Bamboo can live for 15–20 years reproducing vegetatively but then, in
the year of flowering, dies at the height of the summer time immediately after the
ripening of the seeds (see Skulachev8 for discussion).
Striking observations were made in studies of salmon. The Pacific salmon was
shown to die immediately after spawning as a result of accelerated aging (progeria),
which develops when the fish leaves the ocean and swims along a river to its upper
reaches. The traditional explanation of this kind of death was that the animal spends
too much energy when swimming in the river for a long distance against current.
However, this point of view proved to be wrong since (1) aging and death did not
occur if gonads or adrenal glands were removed53 and (2) progeria was observed
even when the river was very short and current was weak. In the Far East of Russia,
two populations of salmon were compared, one spawning in the upper reaches of the
Amur river (thousands of kilometers long) and another spawning in a very small river on the Sakhalin island (only 0.2 km long). In both cases, the spawning fish showed
typical traits of aging that resulted in death. A signal for progeria proved to be
change from the sea to fresh water. In this example, a biological function of suicide
seems to be that the remains of the old fish become food for river invertebrates who,
in turn, are food for the young fish.54

The Atlantic salmon, in contrast to its Pacific relative, after spawning in a river
returns from river to ocean. If it is the summer generation of the fish, it often dies in
the fall. A Russian ichthyologist V.V. Ziuganov has recently studied larvae of a mollusk (pearl mussel Margaritifera margaritifera) that develops in gills of the Atlantic
salmon. He found that larvae can somehow switch off the fish’s “death program” so
the larvae-infected fish live at least one season more than the majority of non-infected salmon (some of infected salmon live up to 13 years). An increase in the host’s
life span is needed for the larvae to complete their own development. It was shown
that the infected fish had fewer tumors and were more resistant to wounds and
burns.54 Leng and colleagues55 reported that a peptide from another mollusk related
to the mussel, a Mercenaria meretrix, activates superoxide dismutase but inhibits
tyrosinase and proliferation of carcinoma cells. Earlier it was shown that a Mercenaria extract possesses anticancer activity and decreases the blood sugar and fat.55

6 Likes

I have found a nice free to air paper which is one of the references:

Dark-cycle, night administration of the pineal hormone melatonin in drinking water to aging mice (15 months of age) prolongs survival of BALB/c females from 23.8 to 28.1 months and preserves aspects of their youthful state. Similar results were seen in New Zealand Black females beginning at 5 months and C57BL/6 males beginning at 19 months. As melatonin is produced in circadian fashion from the pineal, we grafted pineals from young 3- to 4-month-old donors into the thymus of 20-month-old syngeneic C57BL/6 male recipients, and a 12% increase in survival was induced. Prolongation of survival was also seen on pineal transplant to the thymus in C57BL/6, BALB/cJ, and hybrid female mice at 16, 19, and 22 months. In all studies, the endogenous pineal of grafted mice was left in situ. Pineal grafted aged mice display a remarkable maintenance of thymic structure and cellularity. Preservation of T-cell-mediated function, despite age, as measured by response to oxazolone is seen. Other evidence suggests that melatonin and/or pineal-related factors could produce their effects through an influence on thyroid function. These data indicate that pineal influences have a place in the physiologic regulation of aging.

an 18% increase in mouse lifespan from night time melatonin administration.

Another vote for melatonin supplementation. It seems from the 1991 research that night time supplementation is materially better than daytime supplementation. (at least for mice, but humans are not mice)

From the paper itself:

Melatonin treatment in C57BL/6 male mice beginning at 19months prolonged absolute duration of survival by 6 months.

However,

Melatonin has been shown to block ovulation and is now being evaluated as a clinical contraceptive (21).

Figure 2 is particularly interesting as it refers to another paper which compared melatonin supplementation at night to that during the day. It found a slight lifespan increase for melatonin supplementation during the day, but a much greater increase for supplementation at night.

One thing about mice, however, is that they tend to be active at night, but according to ChatGPT their endogenous melatonin production still peaks at night.

5 Likes

This is very interesting. … as I was looking for research on this point I found this interesting paper. It says most laboratory mice don’t make melatonin. A side effect of inbreeding?

I can only see the abstract.

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/07420528.2019.1624373?scroll=top&needAccess=true

Yes, clearly evolution is optimizing for species survival plus adaptation advancement. It doesn’t care about me.

I would be surprised if mice had no melatonin. Some breeds may not generate pineal melatonin.

1 Like

I continue to be interested in melatonin as a longevity aid. The problem is how I must mess with my sleep which itself is a certain longevity lever. Im still hunting for the path of using melatonin for a possible benefit without losing the certain benefit of regular solid sleep.

Perhaps daytime melatonin is a way….

Thoughts?

1 Like

Do you wake at night?

1 Like

Yes. Mostly I follow your protocol for taking a dose if I wake at 1-2am. The problem is … having a protocol means my mind becomes active: (1) I have to check the time (if it’s too late then I won’t take anything, such as 5 minutes before I have to get up), (2) I have to decide to open the bottle and swallow the pill, getting it past my mouth tape.

This seems to me like an interference with my sleep. But I do it. I’d like other ideas if any exist.

You could get it in suppository form unless you use a butt plug.

3 Likes

Oh right, shoving a pill up my butt wouldn’t wake me up much….but thanks for an out of the box idea.

7 Likes

They are expensive because there is quite a bit of melatonin.

4 Likes

Some other papers that link

pierpaoli-regelson-1994-pineal-control-of-aging-effect-of-melatonin-and-pineal-grafting-on-aging-mice.pdf (1.7 MB)

lesnikov1994.pdf (285.3 KB)

pierpaoli2005 (1).pdf (108.0 KB)

1 Like

My view on the pineal is that its role in providing additional melatonin delays the development clock as it reduces damage to mtDNA particularly via the CSF in the brain and nervous system more generally.

2 Likes

I know no one wants/needs/appreciates my useless comments but this gave me the best laugh I’ve had in awhile! Thanks

4 Likes

I had the same reaction. Cannot stop laughing!

1 Like